Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

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spiroyster
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby spiroyster » Sun Jul 16, 2017 11:36 pm

Ah I didn't realise it was that old. I might have to keep an eye out for one if they are cheap enough and it's in good condition. I was hoping it could be VESA mounted with ease, I see piccys on tinterweb suggesting other mounting options than its stock stand, but unsure if these are hack jobs. Is it as heavy as it looks?

Many thanks for enlighting me to this. :)

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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:34 am

It weights 10kg. It's not super heavy for something that is moved only eventually, but I'd not be moving it all the time.
It's unnecessarily heavy. The stand is metal, it's cold to the touch. The articulation to adjust the screen angle is stainless steel and it is firmer than my office screen built in 2015.

None of its weight is to waste, though. Everything is translated into build quality. The count of hardware pieces that would survive a nuclear war that I own has now doubled: the IntelliStation 285 and this screen.

I haven't looked into other ways of mounting it because my desk has the ideal size for screens to be on it, and if I would use something like a VESA articulated arm, the screen would most probably be too far from me.

It looks like, however that you can just unscrew the stand and install something else. I can look into it if you need more information.
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Trippynet » Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:15 am

spiroyster wrote:Mucho drool factor there...

Good to see Viewsonic back in the game, they made some razor sharp CRT's ~Y2K. Their subsequent flatpanel displays were pretty shoddy and quite efficient at brand destruction.

I've been in the market for a new display o.0. What are the mounting options? Is it made by Viewsonic or rebadged?


Depends on the screen I guess. My current screen is a circa 2008 Viewsonic 28" 19:10 screen (VX2835wm) and it's been a fantastic buy (it was pretty competitively priced when I bought it). Ports on the back are a bit fiddly, but apart from that the image quality is decent, no ghosting in games, and it's been a solid and reliable screen for me for many years.

Given a lot of the modern crap out there, I'd struggle to replace it as it's not currently possible to buy a 27-28" screen without having to downgrade to 16:9. It's such a pity how poor so many modern screens are. Race to the bottom at its best...
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:34 pm

Trippynet wrote:Given a lot of the modern crap out there, I'd struggle to replace it as it's not currently possible to buy a 27-28" screen without having to downgrade to 16:9. It's such a pity how poor so many modern screens are. Race to the bottom at its best...


Agreed. At work I had a T61 with a 1680x1050 screen (or 1440x960) and it got replaced by a T400 with a 1366x720 (because people can't handle black borders watching videos) that is more colourblind than I am.

At home, besides the new ViewSonic, I still rock two ThinkVision L220x - 1920x1200, 22 inch, covers 92% Adobe RGB, USB 2 hub, rotation with auto detection by the OS (if you run Windows, you can control colour levels, read usage hours and do firmware upgrades from a built-in app).

To get a decent screen, you need to unload the big bucks. I'm honestly happy with buying old stuff. If they had to break, they would be broken by now. Last year, I bought a model M from a fellow nekochaneer, and it's the best keyboard I've ever had.

Now everything is disposable...
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby spiroyster » Tue Jul 18, 2017 1:48 am

Trippynet wrote:
spiroyster wrote:Mucho drool factor there...

Good to see Viewsonic back in the game, they made some razor sharp CRT's ~Y2K. Their subsequent flatpanel displays were pretty shoddy and quite efficient at brand destruction.

I've been in the market for a new display o.0. What are the mounting options? Is it made by Viewsonic or rebadged?


Depends on the screen I guess. My current screen is a circa 2008 Viewsonic 28" 19:10 screen (VX2835wm) and it's been a fantastic buy (it was pretty competitively priced when I bought it). Ports on the back are a bit fiddly, but apart from that the image quality is decent, no ghosting in games, and it's been a solid and reliable screen for me for many years.

Given a lot of the modern crap out there, I'd struggle to replace it as it's not currently possible to buy a 27-28" screen without having to downgrade to 16:9. It's such a pity how poor so many modern screens are. Race to the bottom at its best...

Viewsonic Flat CRT's were razor sharp with response times to match, and could handle sizable resolutions in comparison to other similar sized around at the time. You're probably right, depends on the model. The first couple of Viewsonic FP's (4:3) I got after the 'transition', were nothing special (and these were VPXXX which I think are the higher-end?) and didn't seem to exhibit anything unique that I loved about their Flat CRT's (just standard old TFT FP). This threads existence certainly seems to throw spanner in the works for shite viewsonic FP... all be it a rebrand o.0

The IBMT221 is certainly gorgeous, would be great for photos/images, but I find myself enlarging text on 1920x1080 displays (I end up like this :shock:, but without the 'shock' factor), so don't know if I would really be able to appreciate the finesse for daily usage. I was looking at the p2415q that guardian mentioned, but Dell's round edges get to me after a while :twisted:. I am looking at the VX2778 now though and liking what I'm seeing. Does anyone have experience with AOC, some of their screens look impressive on paper?

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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby guardian452 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:23 am

spiroyster wrote:Does anyone have experience with AOC, some of their screens look impressive on paper?


I know they've been around forever and sponsor some esports players but honestly all LCD displays look more-or-less the same to me anymore. Generic panel made by one of three big factories (Samsung, LG, ... uhhh ... Sharp?) with a cheezy plastic enclosure with crappy buttons and OSD.

Since they are all more or less the same besides the panel itself (especially since apple killed off the TBD, which I really liked, great speaker etc) you are basically paying for a warranty and support and whether or not it comes with a cord in the box.

In terms of panel, you have a couple gimmicks to choose from: UHD (4k and up), HDR, ultrawide, curved, and g-sync/freesync. The number of inches and pixels is what determines the price. I wouldn't bother paying extra for frills like a USB hub, speakers (excepting apple they are all crap), backside lighting, or fancy stands (any 3rd party stand is better anyways). I'm assuming if you're already here than you're not looking at crappy TN panels unless you're a hardcore gamer that really needs the refresh speed (oled?)

I also understand not wanting a dell because of the curved edges. I like it fine, but if you are buying something that is made to be looked at, it should look good to you even when it's off.


VX2778... 27" WQHD... well if it's anything like my apple TBD was (same size and rez) then you will never, ever get over how big it is :D If you don't need or want hidpi (which *still* has software issues in windows and linux) then it's a great size.

Don't worry about it being 16:9 vs. 16:10 ... these are as big as a television, you will have plenty of vertical real estate.

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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Wed Jul 19, 2017 2:03 am

spiroyster wrote:The IBMT221 is certainly gorgeous, would be great for photos/images, but I find myself enlarging text on 1920x1080 displays (I end up like this :shock:, but without the 'shock' factor), so don't know if I would really be able to appreciate the finesse for daily usage.


OS X and Linux handle scaling pretty well these days.

I was running Maya yesterday on Mac Sierra (because they have hiDPI user interface support), and it's fantastic to see the razor-sharp wireframe model rendered next to beautiful UI art. You get the best of both worlds.

Windows support is still crappy, especially if you add a standard screen to the mix in dual monitor setups, but it is much better than it would be otherwise.
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby guardian452 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 4:32 am

Windows support is GREAT!

Windows apps on the other hand, even fairly new releases since win 10 has come out, are a pathetic joke.

Windows is just full of shovelware garbage, nothing microsoft can do to change that.

MS software (office, etc) works well. If the program is old enough to not support hidpi at all the system will scale it which also works great. But so many donkey-fucker idiot programmers *say* they support hidpi, but everything is broken at anything other than 100% scaling. Two egregious examples I have to put up on a semi-regular basis with are Ewert Energy's Orion and TM4's Odin. Perhaps unsuprisingly these programs don't really work right at 100%, either.

But using Autocad or Solidworks on such a screen (hell, even looking at a PDF drawing) makes it totally worth it :mrgreen:

MacOS uses a much simpler system for scaling so it is a lot easier to support, and non-retina apple machines are rare these days.

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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:53 am

guardian452 wrote:MS software (office, etc) works well.


Not quite...
My work machine is a W10 machine. Whenever I'm out of the office, i have the 1920x1080p 15-inch screen of my laptop set to 125% scaling.

When I dock it, I add a 1920x1200 24-inch screen set to 100%. Whenever I move any Microsoft Office screen from the laptop screen to the external screen, it is unbelievably blurry. It seems like the screen is rendered scaled up and then resized before being sent to the screen, instead of just being drawn at 100% scaling.

The same thing happens with putty. I tried to make a screenshot, but you should be able to reproduce it if you have screens with multiple scaling settings.

So problematic apps: any MS Office apps, Putty, WordPad. Outlook is so bad I actually log in again with scaling set to 100% to work properly.
Ok Apps: Command Prompt/PowerShell/Vim (in text-mode)
Complete disaster: The Device Manager. OMG, the thing scales horribly. The font is super blurry for me on 125% scaling.

I'm on Windows 10 14393 LTSB.
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby guardian452 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:48 am

I have office 365, haven't noticed this problem but I don't use 125%. What version of office are you using?

My windows version is 1703.

I have a 15" FHD laptop (w520) set to 100% and two 24" 4k set to 200% which I have connected to the docking station.

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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Thu Jul 20, 2017 8:46 am

guardian452 wrote:I have office 365, haven't noticed this problem but I don't use 125%. What version of office are you using?


Office 2013.
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Re: Monitor suggestions for high-DPI experiment

Unread postby Shiunbird » Fri Jul 21, 2017 4:33 am

I managed to come up with a way to reproduce what I mean, with a single screen:
1. Set your computer to 125% or 150% scaling.
2. Log out, log in.
3. Set the scaling back to 100%, don't log out. This is how every single application looks on my secondary screen when I have a scaled and a non-scaled screen together.

OS X Leopard will just render the application as it is, so it looks huge on the non-high-DPI screen. OS X Sierra doesn't render the window across screens. Once it is completely moved, the system re-draws the screen at 100% scaling.
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