Nekochan Net

Official Chat Channel: #nekochan // irc.nekochan.net
It is currently Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:38 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Forum rules


No politics, please.



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 78 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:18 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 10:37 pm
Posts: 2914
Location: NZ
PymbleSoftware wrote:
They had object-orientated code in C by use of structs and function pointers.


Similarly, Xt Intrinsics & Motif, MS-Windows & OS/2 PM.

I can't use the original Mac as an example as that was 68k assembler & pascal, but it achieved the same.

_________________
Land of the Long White Cloud and no Software Patents.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2011 3:42 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:48 pm
Posts: 1887
Location: P.O. Box 121, Pymble, Sydney, NSW 2073, Australia.
porter wrote:
PymbleSoftware wrote:
They had object-orientated code in C by use of structs and function pointers.


Similarly, Xt Intrinsics & Motif, MS-Windows & OS/2 PM.

I can't use the original Mac as an example as that was 68k assembler & pascal, but it achieved the same.


... Looks at the shelves and and shelves of X11 books not opened in years and goes ... oh... yeah.... You are right.

R.

_________________
死の神はりんごだけ食べる

開いた括弧は必ず閉じる -- あるプログラマー

:Tezro: :Tezro: :Onyx2R: :Onyx2RE: :Onyx2: :O3x04R: :O3x0: :O200: :Octane: :Octane2: :O2: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :PI: :PI: :1600SW: :1600SW: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy:
:hpserv: J5600, 2 x Mac, 3 x SUN, Alpha DS20E, Alpha 800 5/550, 3 x RS/6000, Amiga 4000 VideoToaster, Amiga4000 -030, 733MHz Sam440 AmigaOS 4.1 update 1.

Sold: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indigo: Tandem Himalaya S-Series Nonstop S72000 ServerNet.

@PymbleSoftware
Cortex ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cortex-th ... 11?sk=info
Minnie ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Minnie-th ... 02?sk=info
Book ----> http://pymblesoftware.com/book/
Github ---> https://github.com/pymblesoftware
Visit http://www.pymblesoftware.com
Search for "Pymble", "InstaElf", "CryWhy" or "Cricket Score Sheet" in the iPad App store or search for "Pymble" or "CryWhy" in the iPhone App store.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:18 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:35 am
Posts: 2005
Location: Vienna, Austria
Actually, originally Thompson set out to create a FORTRAN compiler for "First Edition" Unix but then instead created B [with the help of Ritchie; the "Second Edition" Unix kernel was written in it] which was only later developed into C by Ritchie.

Completely OT again [but as Ritchie was not only the creator of C but also the co-developer of Unix maybe admissible]: AFAIK, Microsoft - before they embarked predominately on DOS etc. - actually was some sort of "Unix"-oriented company as well [Xenix]. I find it unfortunate that they withdraw themselves from that opportunity - otherwise, the PC market today could be probably totally *nix and there wouldn't have been any need for Linux [which just fills the niche Microsoft left open]...Ritchie would have been satisfied, I'm sure.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:12 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:48 pm
Posts: 1887
Location: P.O. Box 121, Pymble, Sydney, NSW 2073, Australia.
Oskar45 wrote:
Actually, originally Thompson set out to create a FORTRAN compiler for "First Edition" Unix but then instead created B [with the help of Ritchie; the "Second Edition" Unix kernel was written in it] which was only later developed into C by Ritchie.

Completely OT again [but as Ritchie was not only the creator of C but also the co-developer of Unix maybe admissible]: AFAIK, Microsoft - before they embarked predominately on DOS etc. - actually was some sort of "Unix"-oriented company as well [Xenix]. I find it unfortunate that they withdraw themselves from that opportunity - otherwise, the PC market today could be probably totally *nix and there wouldn't have been any need for Linux [which just fills the niche Microsoft left open]...Ritchie would have been satisfied, I'm sure.


I think I read somewhere, quite some time ago now that when mickeysoft sold XENIX to SCO, (or was SCO spun out of MSFT?) part of the "goodwill" (intangible assets) was an undertaking the Microsoft would never ever reenter the UNIX market place as some part of a non-complete clause. But then I am not a lawyer and I don't recall where I read that. Microsoft vowed to destroy UNIX, I think such was stated even in their advertising. I also read that they were still doing work on PDP or VAX, and cross-compiling (for DOS?) long after everyone else moved on, http://www.microsoft.com was run on FreeBSD and apache for years even while they were selling IIS, WIndows95 was developed in Canada by the outsourcing company that appears in the Copyright list before Microsoft and SCO when XENIX boots and the original MS-DOS/PC-DOS was developed as a quick hack of what he long over due CP/M-86 could/should have been by a company in Seattle before DRI released CP/M-86. MS-DOS 1.0 ran for about 10 to 15 minutes before locking solid or reseting the machine. But then I never really experienced MS-DOS before I think 2.0 or maybe 3.3. 386BSD was a free UNIX based on articles in Dr Dobbs Journal. Guys around campus put up "Free the Berkley Devil" posters as well as plastic California number plates with "UNIX:Live free or die" on their walls. FREENIX was a movement and bound to happen Linux just got there first. There was MINIX, the XINU book and other things happening but it was all very academic.

R.

_________________
死の神はりんごだけ食べる

開いた括弧は必ず閉じる -- あるプログラマー

:Tezro: :Tezro: :Onyx2R: :Onyx2RE: :Onyx2: :O3x04R: :O3x0: :O200: :Octane: :Octane2: :O2: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :PI: :PI: :1600SW: :1600SW: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy:
:hpserv: J5600, 2 x Mac, 3 x SUN, Alpha DS20E, Alpha 800 5/550, 3 x RS/6000, Amiga 4000 VideoToaster, Amiga4000 -030, 733MHz Sam440 AmigaOS 4.1 update 1.

Sold: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indigo: Tandem Himalaya S-Series Nonstop S72000 ServerNet.

@PymbleSoftware
Cortex ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cortex-th ... 11?sk=info
Minnie ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Minnie-th ... 02?sk=info
Book ----> http://pymblesoftware.com/book/
Github ---> https://github.com/pymblesoftware
Visit http://www.pymblesoftware.com
Search for "Pymble", "InstaElf", "CryWhy" or "Cricket Score Sheet" in the iPad App store or search for "Pymble" or "CryWhy" in the iPhone App store.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 3:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 10:37 pm
Posts: 2914
Location: NZ
PymbleSoftware wrote:
FREENIX was a movement and bound to happen Linux just got there first.


What alot of people think of as Linux, is actually GNU.

Linux just slotted in where the Hurd was supposed to be, as it got stuck in a tar-pit.

_________________
Land of the Long White Cloud and no Software Patents.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:48 pm
Posts: 1887
Location: P.O. Box 121, Pymble, Sydney, NSW 2073, Australia.
porter wrote:
PymbleSoftware wrote:
FREENIX was a movement and bound to happen Linux just got there first.


What alot of people think of as Linux, is actually GNU.

Linux just slotted in where the Hurd was supposed to be, as it got stuck in a tar-pit.



Some people have even taken to calling it GNU/Linux.

They were just waiting for Duke Nukem Forever to be released before releasing the Hurd.

Yowsa, are we off topic yet?


R.

_________________
死の神はりんごだけ食べる

開いた括弧は必ず閉じる -- あるプログラマー

:Tezro: :Tezro: :Onyx2R: :Onyx2RE: :Onyx2: :O3x04R: :O3x0: :O200: :Octane: :Octane2: :O2: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :PI: :PI: :1600SW: :1600SW: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy:
:hpserv: J5600, 2 x Mac, 3 x SUN, Alpha DS20E, Alpha 800 5/550, 3 x RS/6000, Amiga 4000 VideoToaster, Amiga4000 -030, 733MHz Sam440 AmigaOS 4.1 update 1.

Sold: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indigo: Tandem Himalaya S-Series Nonstop S72000 ServerNet.

@PymbleSoftware
Cortex ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cortex-th ... 11?sk=info
Minnie ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Minnie-th ... 02?sk=info
Book ----> http://pymblesoftware.com/book/
Github ---> https://github.com/pymblesoftware
Visit http://www.pymblesoftware.com
Search for "Pymble", "InstaElf", "CryWhy" or "Cricket Score Sheet" in the iPad App store or search for "Pymble" or "CryWhy" in the iPhone App store.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:11 am 
Offline

Joined: Tue Sep 20, 2005 4:10 pm
Posts: 915
Location: IRL
Oskar45 wrote:
Actually, originally Thompson set out to create a FORTRAN compiler for "First Edition" Unix but then instead created B [with the help of Ritchie; the "Second Edition" Unix kernel was written in it] which was only later developed into C by Ritchie.

B was interpreted, so I'm not sure it would have been suitable to develop any kernels back then, considering the hardware they were working with. I think the paper R-10-k linked to suggests this:
"On the PDP-7 Unix system, only a few things were written in B except B itself, because the machine was too small and too slow to do more than experiment; rewriting the operating system and the utilities wholly into B was too expensive a step to seem feasible."

I think ultimately, the desire for B-like syntax with assembly-like performance motivated the development for a system oriented language like C. Despite its flaws, it certainly succeeded as a both a system development and a general programming language.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 3:31 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:35 am
Posts: 2005
Location: Vienna, Austria
Lions ended his celebrated 1977 A COMMENTARY ON THE SIXTH EDITION UNIX OPERATING SYSTEM with the following:
Quote:
Discuss the merits of “C” as a systems programming language. What features are missing? or superfluous?
Not sure these questions have ever been answered conclusively...

PS: I have never found his other notes on the V6 source. Outdated, sure - but most certainly instructive even after 30+ years.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:09 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:35 am
Posts: 2005
Location: Vienna, Austria
Oskar45 wrote:
PS: I have never found his other notes on the V6 source.
Found the V6 source finally. Would be interested to know how IRIX differs source-wise.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 12:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:37 am
Posts: 5735
Location: Renton, WA
FWIW Ritchie did get a brief 2.5" or so of column space and a picture on pg. 2 of the Seattle Times. What did others see in their papers?

_________________
Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!

There are those who say I'm a bit of a curmudgeon. To them I reply: "GET OFF MY LAWN!"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 3:02 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:48 pm
Posts: 1887
Location: P.O. Box 121, Pymble, Sydney, NSW 2073, Australia.
SAQ wrote:
FWIW Ritchie did get a brief 2.5" or so of column space and a picture on pg. 2 of the Seattle Times. What did others see in their papers?


The SeattleTimes article:
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/b ... tchie.html

Quote:
SAN FRANCISCO —
Dennis Ritchie, a pioneer in computer programming, has died at age 70, according to his longtime employer.

Ritchie created the popular C programming language and helped create the Unix operating software. He died a month after his birthday, according to his biography on a webpage of Alcatel-Lucent's Bell Labs. Ritchie joined Bell Labs in the late 1960s.

The company confirmed his death to The Associated Press but would not disclose the cause of death or when Ritchie died. A spokeswoman said the company was trying to contact his family.

Ritchie is best known for his contributions to computer programming and software. The C programming language, which Ritchie developed in the early 1970's, is still popular. It has gone through a number of upgrades, and it is commonly used for website development and other computer tasks. The Unix operating software also surged in popularity. It and its offshoots, including the open-source Linux, are widely used today, in corporate servers and even cellphones.

Ritchie's biography on the Bell Labs site says that he was born on Sept. 9, 1941 in Bronxville, N.Y., and studied physics and math at Harvard University.

"My undergraduate experience convinced me that I was not smart enough to be a physicist, and that computers were quite neat," Ritchie wrote. "My graduate school experience convinced me that I was not smart enough to be an expert in the theory of algorithms and also that I liked procedural languages better than functional ones."

Jeong Kim, president of Bell Labs, wrote in a blog post Thursday that Ritchie was "truly an inspiration to all of us, not just for his many accomplishments, but because of who he was as a friend, an inventor, and a humble and gracious man."



A small regional Murdoch paper in Australia in a city of barely a couple of million people, http://www.couriermail.com.au/ipad/obit ... 6174426413
and thus, in the obituary pages it was wrote:
COMPUTER scientist Dennis Ritchie was born in 1941 in New York City and died in 2011 in New Jersey.

Although not a household name like Steve Jobs or Bill Gates, Dennis Ritchie (known to his friends simply as "dmr" his computer user name) was one of the small band of visionaries who between them created the digital revolution.

He was the brains behind both the C programming language and the co-developer of the ubiquitous UNIX operating system, inventions which helped usher in the internet and smart phones to name but a few of the applications which have emerged from their ideas.

The development of Unix was such a milestone, in fact, that it won him a Turing Award in 1983 (the computing world's equivalent of a Nobel prize).

Born in New York in 1941, he was one of the baby boomer cohort which came of age as personal computing took off.

And like many of them, his emergence had as much to do with good genes as it did with good timing. His father Alistair was a leading researcher at Bell Labs where Dennis Ritchie was later to begin his brilliant career.

By the time he joined Bell in 1967, after graduating from Harvard University in physics, it had launched a landmark project called "Multics" with General Electric and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology.

It was billed as the world's most ambitious computing project and allowed several hundred users to work on the same mainframe computer at the same time a laughably small system these days, but back then unheard of.

Bell was responsible for the operating software and Mr Ritchie was thrown into the deep end, given the task of trying to sort out the crisis the project was in at the time.

After four years of gruelling and expensive work, Bell gave up. Ritchie and another lead programmer on Multics, Ken Thompson, did not.

Realising that they needed to design a much simpler system, over a couple of months in 1969 they came up with what they called Unix.

After scrounging obsolete mainframes to test it on, within three years they had a working prototype up and running.

They also talked Bell into trying it on one of tis big mainframes and rewrote the operating system for this new machine in a language Ritchie co-invented, which he called C. It bridged the gap between machine code and programming languages.

Because Bell Labs' parent, AT&T, was a regulated telephone monopoly, it was not allowed to compete with the then still fledgling US computer industry and so the altruistic Ritchie decided to distribute Unix for free to universities and research institutions.

It became a hit and developed a cult-like following, particularly after Bill Gates developed his own all-conquering operating system.

One of Unix's legion of fans was none other than former Apple chief executive Steve Jobs, who used it as the basis for his NeXT workstation when he was forced out of Apple in the mid-1980s and later for all of Apple's products including iphones when he re-joined the company.

Ironically, after the US government deregulated the telecommunications industry, AT&T tried to close down free usage of Unix.

This generated a now-famous backlash from Unix's fan base and following the efforts of a MIT hacker in 1983 hundreds of amateur programmers came up with their own version which came to be known as Linux.

Despite never achieving any great public fame for his profound breakthroughs (his death, one week after that of Steve Jobs, went almost unremarked in the mainstream media), Mr Ritchie nevertheless was showered with awards.

Among them were the prestigious Japan Prize, a fellowship of the US National Academy of Engineering and the National Medal of Technology which was personally presented to him in 1999 by then president Bill Clinton.

Mr Ritchie had been in poor health for several years after battling both prostate cancer and heart disease.

Mr Ritchie is survived by two brothers and a sister.


The San Francisco Chronicle has two articles, neither of which match the Murdoch paper article exactly. Normally Australian papers just take what is on the wires (Reuters or whatever) and reprint it...

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/tec ... y_id=99607

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... 1LHD7C.DTL


The communist party Pravda, I mean Sydney Morning Herald... has nothing, nada, zip on Dennis Ritchie... It wasn't about the glorious unions crippling the national airline (so the twice unelected somewhere to the left of Karl Marx minority government can nationalize it, comrade) or whitewashing union bosses now members of a extremely socialist federal (and feral) government running up hundreds of thousands of dollars on prostitutes on union credit cards.... so it never happened.

The Murdoch papers are becoming subscription based so the unwashed masses will remain ignorant commie unwashed masses in this country.

R.

_________________
死の神はりんごだけ食べる

開いた括弧は必ず閉じる -- あるプログラマー

:Tezro: :Tezro: :Onyx2R: :Onyx2RE: :Onyx2: :O3x04R: :O3x0: :O200: :Octane: :Octane2: :O2: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :PI: :PI: :1600SW: :1600SW: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy:
:hpserv: J5600, 2 x Mac, 3 x SUN, Alpha DS20E, Alpha 800 5/550, 3 x RS/6000, Amiga 4000 VideoToaster, Amiga4000 -030, 733MHz Sam440 AmigaOS 4.1 update 1.

Sold: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indigo: Tandem Himalaya S-Series Nonstop S72000 ServerNet.

@PymbleSoftware
Cortex ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cortex-th ... 11?sk=info
Minnie ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Minnie-th ... 02?sk=info
Book ----> http://pymblesoftware.com/book/
Github ---> https://github.com/pymblesoftware
Visit http://www.pymblesoftware.com
Search for "Pymble", "InstaElf", "CryWhy" or "Cricket Score Sheet" in the iPad App store or search for "Pymble" or "CryWhy" in the iPhone App store.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 6:08 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Fri May 09, 2003 5:10 am
Posts: 2931
Location: Maryland, USA
Great programmer. Clear thinker. In all his public writing, seemed a humble, down-to-earth fellow. Definitely an inspiration and an example of the of a single person having a huge impact on society.

I love C.
I love Unix.

So long, Dennie Ritchie and thanks.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:28 pm
Posts: 480
Location: Boston
When it rains, it pours. John McCarthy died today.
I suppose the MSM coverage will be even sparser yet.

_________________
:PI: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indigo2IMP:


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 2:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 15, 2008 4:48 pm
Posts: 1887
Location: P.O. Box 121, Pymble, Sydney, NSW 2073, Australia.
robespierre wrote:
When it rains, it pours. John McCarthy died today.
I suppose the MSM coverage will be even sparser yet.


The end of a generation... what did they do...? UNIX, C, Lisp, Apple..
What did the next generation do...? FaceBook, Twitter, :roll:

R.

_________________
死の神はりんごだけ食べる

開いた括弧は必ず閉じる -- あるプログラマー

:Tezro: :Tezro: :Onyx2R: :Onyx2RE: :Onyx2: :O3x04R: :O3x0: :O200: :Octane: :Octane2: :O2: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :PI: :PI: :1600SW: :1600SW: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy:
:hpserv: J5600, 2 x Mac, 3 x SUN, Alpha DS20E, Alpha 800 5/550, 3 x RS/6000, Amiga 4000 VideoToaster, Amiga4000 -030, 733MHz Sam440 AmigaOS 4.1 update 1.

Sold: :Indy: :Indy: :Indy: :Indigo: Tandem Himalaya S-Series Nonstop S72000 ServerNet.

@PymbleSoftware
Cortex ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Cortex-th ... 11?sk=info
Minnie ---> http://www.facebook.com/pages/Minnie-th ... 02?sk=info
Book ----> http://pymblesoftware.com/book/
Github ---> https://github.com/pymblesoftware
Visit http://www.pymblesoftware.com
Search for "Pymble", "InstaElf", "CryWhy" or "Cricket Score Sheet" in the iPad App store or search for "Pymble" or "CryWhy" in the iPhone App store.


Top
 Profile  
 
Unread postPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2011 4:18 pm 
Offline
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 8:53 pm
Posts: 2857
Location: USA
robespierre wrote:
When it rains, it pours. John McCarthy died today.

I was wondering why my Siri was crying.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 78 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group