Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

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porter
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Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby porter » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:12 pm

I must admit I am not impressed by the Lion OS installation strategy, unless I am mistaken, there is no image for either USB or DVD.

If you trash your new machine you do a network boot from one of Apple's servers.

So imagine 5 years down the track, Lion has been deprecated, and the latest release of Cougar won't run on your recently defined as inferior machine. Which will probably only run on 64bit ARM. Your now new Intel Mac will be looked on with the same disdain as a PPC model is now.

I see this as a deliberate attempt to kill the 2nd hand Mac market and turn Macs into high-priced, high-turnover commodity machines.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby josehill » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:28 pm

From Apple's Lion press release - "later this August, Lion will be made available on a USB thumb drive through the Apple Store® (www.apple.com) for $69 (US)."

http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2011/07 ... Store.html

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porter
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby porter » Wed Aug 03, 2011 9:42 pm

Cool, thanks.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby jan-jaap » Thu Aug 04, 2011 1:32 am

porter wrote:I must admit I am not impressed by the Lion OS installation strategy, unless I am mistaken, there is no image for either USB or DVD.

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-20 ... tion-disc/
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby Martin Steen » Thu Aug 04, 2011 2:09 am

jan-jaap wrote:
porter wrote:I must admit I am not impressed by the Lion OS installation strategy, unless I am mistaken, there is no image for either USB or DVD.

http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-13727_7-20 ... tion-disc/


I made an USB-stick with Lion using a german instruction page:
http://www.netzwelt.de/news/87609-anlei ... ellen.html

It works nice with an 8GB stick.

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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby jimmer » Thu Aug 04, 2011 7:30 am

turn Macs into high-priced, high-turnover commodity machines

Turn? surely Macs have been exactly that for quite a while now....

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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby R-ten-K » Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:09 pm

jimmer wrote:
turn Macs into high-priced, high-turnover commodity machines

Turn? surely Macs have been exactly that for quite a while now....




Psssst. Apple's business plan has revolved around the commoditization of computers, and to make as much money from that process as possible, from day 1. In fact that is the whole point of this industry, it is a very well kept secret so careful passing it on.

With no commodities, there are no products. With no products, there is no value added. Without continuous demand to pay more for the added value from the product than the sum of its commodities, there is no profit. And without profit, there are no shareholders. And without the shareholders, there are no corporations. And without corporations, there is no monetary system. And without a monetary system, we won't be able to trade baseball cards with pictures of death presidents on them. And without funny looking pictures of death presidents on them, the universe gets really mad and it ceases to exit.

So really, at the end of the day Apple is just a corporation who is doing us all a favor saving the universe by being so good at capitalism. Don't hate the player, hate the game... etc, etc.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby smj » Thu Aug 04, 2011 3:18 pm

R-ten-K wrote:... with pictures of death presidents on them. And without funny looking pictures of death presidents on them, ...

Are you by any chance using Lion and have not disabled auto-correct? :P
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby milatchi » Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:12 am

porter wrote:I see this as a deliberate attempt to kill the 2nd hand Mac market and turn Macs into high-priced, high-turnover commodity machines.


I see this as probably a long term goal of Apple. Welcome to the future! Soon everything will be disposable :D
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby SAQ » Sat Aug 06, 2011 10:09 am

There are instructions for how to extract the install files from the downloaded install - they´re on the net somewhere (look up Lion DVD or similar). I think that you´ve hit the nail on the head precisely on how Apple and MS intend to do things (¨we don´t support that version anymore, so you can´t download it. Buy a new one). MS has already come up with creative new ways to make you buy a new Windows license - officially they won´t let you install from another Windows disk if you loose yours.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby porter » Sat Aug 06, 2011 1:28 pm

Perhaps natural selection will mean that all machines will either end up in the dumpster or be running Linux when the vendor deems their useful life has passed.

I have bought only two new computers in the last twenty years! :) So tend to want to keep older machines working as I deliberately stay off the bleeding edge when it my own money. Work is another matter.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby smj » Sat Aug 06, 2011 1:54 pm

SAQ wrote:I think that you´ve hit the nail on the head precisely on how Apple and MS intend to do things (¨we don´t support that version anymore, so you can´t download it. Buy a new one). MS has already come up with creative new ways to make you buy a new Windows license - officially they won´t let you install from another Windows disk if you loose yours.

Or you get what I got, expanded.

I bought Windows 7 Ultimate OEM on eBay - sorry, if I can find somebody selling it for less that US$275 then yes, I'm going for it. Well what they shipped was a legit package complete with Ingram Micro stock stickers -- but for RoW ("Rest of World"), not North America. MSFT has had differential regionalized pricing for a while now, and it appears with all the phone-home functions they're enforcing it based on IP geomapping.

So my Dell Precision 690 now boots up and complains that it isn't "Genuine Windows," and has a little text tag to that effect in the bottom right corner of all active dispays...
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby guardian452 » Mon Aug 08, 2011 7:05 am

So imagine 5 years down the track, Lion has been deprecated, and the latest release of Cougar won't run on your recently defined as inferior machine. Which will probably only run on 64bit ARM. Your now new Intel Mac will be looked on with the same disdain as a PPC model is now.

While I agree with R10's statement (don't hate the player, hate the game) maybe there is good reason for not upgrading your crappy 5 year old computer to a shiny new OS; grandma's 5 year old macbook still runs tiger just fine.

high-priced, high-turnover commodity machines.
but macs are cheap and 5 years is a low-turnover... Isn't this an SGI site where machines cost $100k+ and had a typical useful life of two or three years?

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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby porter » Mon Aug 08, 2011 4:00 pm

guardian452 wrote:maybe there is good reason for not upgrading your crappy 5 year old computer to a shiny new OS; grandma's 5 year old macbook still runs tiger just fine.


I was looking at the situation where you buy a new machine now, and can't get a copy of the media for the OS. So in five years time when you want to rebuild it from scratch due to the crap and cruft it has accumulated or the disk crapping out, then you can't.

Fortunately for the moment there look like ways and means of getting the media for Lion.
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Re: Lion - the slippery slope for OS installations

Unread postby fu » Tue Aug 09, 2011 3:49 am

haven't tested lion yet, and you guys probably know this already but since porter is looking for a solution, apple just posted Lion Recovery Disk Assistant

(nice prose r10 :))


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