Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

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jc179
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Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 9:59 am

Hi

I'm still unclear after reading the wiki and searching; but I have an octane and I'd like to: 2 things

Upgrade the CPU to a dual (can't find anything saying I can't just specific to memory upgrading(problems with large dimms)).
Upgrade to V6Pro graphics.

I cannot find in Hinv or anything else what Xbow I have, from what I've read I see I need 1.3 or sometimes that is not even the case.

I have these part #'s

MB: 030-0887-003 Rev M (original motherboard)
CPU: 030-0888-04 and also cpu 030 1138-002 in a static bag.
Backplane / Frontplane ? - 030-0891-003 Rev C.

I have the lucent ~600W psu, but I read that it does not make a difference for V6 / V8.

Currently it has the SI Graphics card in it. 020-0938-003.

Like I said I'd like to get dual cpu, R10k, perhaps R12k if I can afford it. Also like to get better graphics the SI. I have no Tram.

Any suggestions / help / info welcome!

Thanks much

Jonathan
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby nekonoko » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:02 am

You can upgrade, but you'll need to upgrade your graphics drivers for the V6 so make sure you have an IRIX set available before proceeding.
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:07 am

Ah I just got the machine so the drives are blank :)

Just wanted to check and make sure the older version of the motherboard would support the dual cpu's :) I guess it stands for R10k or R12k the same would work ?

I will install 6.5.15 before to see if it upgrades the prom in the machine also!

Is the V6pro much better than MXI ? as it has built in texture memory?

Thanks

Jonathan
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby nekonoko » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:10 am

jc179 wrote:Just wanted to check and make sure the older version of the motherboard would support the dual cpu's :) I guess it stands for R10k or R12k the same would work ?


Yes, the motherboard revision is irrelevant for dual CPUs.

Is the V6pro much better than MXI ? as it has built in texture memory?


Yes, it has built in texture memory.

http://www.nekochan.net/wiki/VPro
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jan-jaap » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:13 am

jc179 wrote:Just wanted to check and make sure the older version of the motherboard would support the dual cpu's :) I guess it stands for R10k or R12k the same would work ?

The '887' board is supported with any single or dual CPU up to 400MHz, except the 270MHz R12k.
Some people claim it works with faster CPUs too, but compared to a faster CPU, a '1467' is very cheap so I wouldn't bother.
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:13 am

nekonoko thank you so much!

JC
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 10:15 am

Ah maybe thats why the Dual 270 R12k I found was cheap?

Its good you mention that was just about to buy it. Is there anyway to make it work with 887 board, or should I just wait and ebay a newer 1467 Board?

Thanks



jan-jaap wrote:
jc179 wrote:Just wanted to check and make sure the older version of the motherboard would support the dual cpu's :) I guess it stands for R10k or R12k the same would work ?

The '887' board is supported with any single or dual CPU up to 400MHz, except the 270MHz R12k.
Some people claim it works with faster CPUs too, but compared to a CPU faster CPU, a '1467' is very cheap so I wouldn't bother.
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby The Keeper » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:12 am

This is always the conundrum with older systems... You have a first-gen Octane, knowing that you have an 0887 mobo with an 0888 CPU (meaning single 195MHz R10k).

As a point of reference, the other CPU that you have in the bag is a 175MHz R10k, which is as low as you can go, so you may as well reclaim the aluminum from the heat sink and the gold from the CPU chip. Even 400MHz R12k single-CPU modules are only like $30-40, and they feel a half-dozen times faster than a 175MHz R10k.

Anyway, given that you have an 0887 and 0888, you have either a 1.2 XBow or a 1.3 XBow. Neither of those revisions is intended to be used with a VPro. Once you find a blue chassis with a 1.4 XBow, V6's are pretty cheap, if you can find one by itself, but the problem is you can't drive a display at 1280x1024@72Hz with a V6.

Jury's out on the idea of the 270MHz R12k thing, though. Early on, I had seen reports of 270MHz R12k not working with an 0887. But since then, that myth has been busted. You know what? I think probably the PROM itself is what the problem was. 270MHz is a weird number, so maybe it just wasn't in the tables of the earlier PROMs. Versions of IRIX subsequent to what was in use when the CPU didn't work was initially reported may have support for the 270.

But I digress a bit.

I would recommend that an SSE (or MXE, which is an SSE with texture) would probably be your best bet for graphics options, knowing that you have an older XBow, and upgrading the XBow is generally a fork-lift upgrade.

You could go with either a dual 270, or a single 400, which would probably give you about the same relative performance.

Regarding memory, knowing that you have an 0887, you just have to stay away from memories with a purple dot on the spine. The purple dot means it's 1467-only memory.

Good luck!
Chris
:O2000R: (<-EMXI/IO6G) :O200: :O200: :O200: (<- quad R12k O200 w/GIGAchannel and ESI+Tex) plus a bunch of assorted standalone workstations...

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 11:24 am

The Keeper wrote:This is always the conundrum with older systems... You have a first-gen Octane, knowing that you have an 0887 mobo with an 0888 CPU (meaning single 195MHz R10k).

As a point of reference, the other CPU that you have in the bag is a 175MHz R10k, which is as low as you can go, so you may as well reclaim the aluminum from the heat sink and the gold from the CPU chip. Even 400MHz R12k single-CPU modules are only like $30-40, and they feel a half-dozen times faster than a 175MHz R10k.



Yes I realize it's quite slow, good to know I can upgrade the cpu though !

Anyway, given that you have an 0887 and 0888, you have either a 1.2 XBow or a 1.3 XBow. Neither of those revisions is intended to be used with a VPro. Once you find a blue chassis with a 1.4 XBow, V6's are pretty cheap, if you can find one by itself, but the problem is you can't drive a display at 1280x1024@72Hz with a V6.


This is where I'm not following exactly, I understand the V6 Pro isn't *suppost* to work as per sgi offical statement but I have seen that it's said too on the older systems (only the xbox 1.3 iirc) but I am not sure. If I can just keep the old system that is perfect for me, I paid only $30 for it. So I am back to my original question that I seem to get different answers for, has anyone actually put a V6 pro in a original green case and had it work? (even if it only works at one resolution, say 1280x1024) or whatever it may be.


I am just confused between nekonoko and your answer, just want to confirm that intended doesn't mean I can't do it :) I just want to keep costs down, but have something decent, if I have to MacGuiver it that is ok with me !

You could go with either a dual 270, or a single 400, which would probably give you about the same relative performance.

Regarding memory, knowing that you have an 0887, you just have to stay away from memories with a purple dot on the spine. The purple dot means it's 1467-only memory.

Good luck!
Chris



Thank you !

I might just go for a faster cpu then. I think twice as fast is a bit better than two, making the same speed, because not everything is smp.
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby kshuff » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:41 pm

jan-jaap wrote:
jc179 wrote:Just wanted to check and make sure the older version of the motherboard would support the dual cpu's :) I guess it stands for R10k or R12k the same would work ?

The '887' board is supported with any single or dual CPU up to 400MHz, except the 270MHz R12k.
Some people claim it works with faster CPUs too, but compared to a faster CPU, a '1467' is very cheap so I wouldn't bother.


Not a claim, I'm running an R14k @ 550MHz on an old 0887 motherboard and never had a problem.

Code: Select all

Octane 1% hinv -vm
Location: /hw/node
      PM10550MHZ Board: barcode MCV466     part 030-1700-001 rev  D
Location: /hw/node/xtalk/15
            IP30 Board: barcode GRT701     part 030-0887-004 rev  A
Location: /hw/node/xtalk/15/pci/2
    PWR.SPPLY.SR Board: barcode AAB7240141 part 060-0028-003 rev  A
             FP1 Board: barcode FSN315     part 030-0891-003 rev  C
Location: /hw/node/xtalk/12
           MOT20 Board: barcode LMC144     part 030-1240-003 rev  H
1 550 MHZ IP30 Processor
Heart ASIC: Revision E
CPU: MIPS R14000 Processor Chip Revision: 2.3
FPU: MIPS R14010 Floating Point Chip Revision: 0.0
Main memory size: 1536 Mbytes
Xbow ASIC: Revision 1.3
Instruction cache size: 32 Kbytes
Data cache size: 32 Kbytes
Secondary unified instruction/data cache size: 2 Mbytes
Integral SCSI controller 0: Version QL1040B (rev. 2), single ended
  Disk drive: unit 1 on SCSI controller 0 (unit 1)
  Disk drive: unit 2 on SCSI controller 0 (unit 2)
Integral SCSI controller 1: Version QL1040B (rev. 2), single ended
IOC3/IOC4 serial port: tty1
IOC3/IOC4 serial port: tty2
IOC3 parallel port: plp1
Graphics board: ESSI
Integral Fast Ethernet: ef0, version 1, pci 2
Iris Audio Processor: version RAD revision 12.0, number 1
  PCI Adapter ID (vendor 0x10a9, device 0x0003) PCI slot 2
  PCI Adapter ID (vendor 0x1077, device 0x1020) PCI slot 0
  PCI Adapter ID (vendor 0x1077, device 0x1020) PCI slot 1
  PCI Adapter ID (vendor 0x10a9, device 0x0005) PCI slot 3
-ks

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby jc179 » Thu Mar 20, 2008 1:49 pm

Ah Super - very good to know. Found more info to clarify some more things that nekonoko explained but I got further confused on lol.

from
http://www.futuretech.blinkenlights.nl/ ... uying.html

Version 1.2: Will not support the quad ethernet/six serial card or VPro (XXX-TODO)
Version 1.3: Supports the quad ethernet/six serial card and VPro V6/V8 but NOT V10/V12
Version 1.4: Supports V6/V8/V10/V12 and the quad ethernet/six serial card.



Version 1.3 is the most likely to be found in the older Octanes (according to the quad ethernet/six serial card manual the 1.2 > 1.3 upgrade should have been free - but that was a while ago)
Version 1.4 is the version in the last Octanes and the Octane2 machines


Was 1.2 -> 1.3 upgrade some sort of firmware upgrade?
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby SAQ » Thu Mar 20, 2008 4:46 pm

The Xbow revs were hardware chip revisions in the XBOW chip - no easy way to upgrade it other than a FP1 (frontplane) replacement.

Regarding the -0887, 1.3 XBOW, Vpro and Dualies - I'm running a 2x250MHz R10k machine with V6 graphics on a -0887 and 1.3 XBOW. The machine was originally a 250MHz/2MB Scache SSE box, so it's a bit newer than yours and came with the Cherokee PSU as standard. I'm not sure how much of an impediment the wrong PSU is, but I can say that for V6 the 1.3 is not an impediment. Sadly, 96Hz-capable monitors aren't too common, none of the ones on my desk (IBM P200, Radius Intellicolor 20/e, Hitachi 19") support it, but V10/V12 are substantially more expensive.
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby The Keeper » Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:38 pm

SAQ wrote: but V10/V12 are substantially more expensive.


And not supported by the 1.2/1.3 XBows, which is certainly what this system includes.

I don't see any cheap graphics cards or CPU modules at the moment, though, unfortunately. Piecemeal upgrades can cause more problems than they're worth, but if you're patient, and can wait a month or two for a deal to come along, then you should be ok.

I realize you're trying to keep costs down, but keep in mind that if you really want to upgrade, you're probably better off going after something like this system:
http://cgi.ebay.com/SILICON-GRAPHICS-OC ... dZViewItem

Good luck!

Chris
:O2000R: (<-EMXI/IO6G) :O200: :O200: :O200: (<- quad R12k O200 w/GIGAchannel and ESI+Tex) plus a bunch of assorted standalone workstations...

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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby nekonoko » Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:44 pm

The Keeper wrote:I realize you're trying to keep costs down, but keep in mind that if you really want to upgrade, you're probably better off going after something like this system:
http://cgi.ebay.com/SILICON-GRAPHICS-OC ... dZViewItem


Wow, that looks like a pretty nice system too - heh, I remember paying $1000+ for an Octane2 just a few years ago :P
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Re: Octane Info (Upgrade paths) - Can I do this ...?

Unread postby The Keeper » Thu Mar 20, 2008 8:49 pm

Yeah, and it was about that time that I stopped buying and selling SGI gear on a regular basis; the prices were dropping too quickly for me.

Speaking of a variation, head on over to http://www.gsaauctions.gov, and search for "silicon". Check out the "mainframe" going for $2600, and please explain to me why someone would be willing to pay that much for a handful of Origin racks, where you can't even see what's installed...

Chris
:O2000R: (<-EMXI/IO6G) :O200: :O200: :O200: (<- quad R12k O200 w/GIGAchannel and ESI+Tex) plus a bunch of assorted standalone workstations...


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