Page 2 of 4

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:54 am
by Hombre71
kubatyszko wrote:I just noticed that you seem to be missing the 5V aux line - all of the "aux" should be showing up in standby.
What is VERY strange, is that you have all of the 3.3V aux ones, and 5V aux PIMM.

ATX only provides one 5V rail in standby, so if you see 5V in one place but not the other that's odd, and even better, since the 3v3 aux ones are actually converted from 5V - this proves that the 5VSB gets to your fuel just fine.

From this information I can deduce that either one of your DS1780 (monitoring chips) is fried or something on the board makes the monitoring not work - could be short of the 5V just before the monitoring input.


Hmmm, I just noticed this indeed

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>ALERT: Error initializing DS1780 0, no acknowledge

SGI SN1 L1 Controller
Firmware Image B: Rev. 1.10.12, Built 02/01/2002 14:40:22


Do based on the number 0 can we identify which one is likely to be toast?

Or is there another way to double check both(?) DS1780 chips through L1 command or other test?

Cheers

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 3:57 am
by Hombre71
I would be interested to see the output from someone's running Fuel with the test intr command in L1.
Mine now gives:

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>test intr
I2C interrupts, High: 1  Low: 0
  NODE 0 DS1780, 1:    0 (0x00) 2:    0 (0x00)
  NODE 1 DS1780, 1:    0 (0x00) 2:    0 (0x00)
  NODE 2 DS1780, 1:    0 (0x00) 2:    0 (0x00)
    PIMM DS1780, 1:    0 (0x00) 2:    0 (0x00)
 ODYSSEY DS1780, 1:    0 (0x00) 2:    0 (0x00)
     BUS SELECT I/O Expander:    0
 MARGIN CONTROL I/O Expander:    0
       LED0 LOW I/O Expander:    0
 ASIC CONTROL 1 I/O Expander:    0
 ASIC CONTROL 2 I/O Expander:    0
   POWER ENABLE I/O Expander:    0
     XB CONTROL I/O Expander:    0
   PIMM CONTROL I/O Expander:    0
    ODYSSEY GFX I/O Expander:    0
DISPLAY CONTROL I/O Expander:    0
001a01-L1>

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:07 am
by Hombre71
Hmmm, I just noticed this indeed

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>ALERT: Error initializing DS1780 0, no acknowledge

SGI SN1 L1 Controller
Firmware Image B: Rev. 1.10.12, Built 02/01/2002 14:40:22


Do based on the number 0 can we identify which one is likely to be toast?

Or is there another way to double check both(?) DS1780 chips through L1 command or other test?

Cheers[/quote]

I suppose there should be a hint in which fans are reported as 'no acknowledge' as well :

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>fan
fan(s) are on.
fan 0 EXHAUST  rpm 0 (255).
fan 1 ERROR I2C:no acknowledge.
fan 2 ERROR I2C:no acknowledge.
fan 3 XIO 1    rpm 0 (255).
fan 4 XIO 2    rpm 0 (255).
fan 5 PS       rpm 0 (255).
001a01-L1>

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 4:56 am
by mazzinia
you could try

test i2c

maybe helps to identify the one having troubles. But I "think" having read on this forum that i2c chips can give errors either if faulty, or if not receiving the +5v

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 5:12 am
by Hombre71
mazzinia wrote:you could try

test i2c

maybe helps to identify the one having troubles. But I "think" having read on this forum that i2c chips can give errors either if faulty, or if not receiving the +5v


Code: Select all

001a01-L1>test i2cError reading the NODE 0 DS1780 Company ID, bus 68 addr 0x2c -                                                                                                                             no acknowledge

error -1 on tst.
001a01-L1>

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 7:07 am
by mazzinia
well, guess we know which one has troubles.
I may be wrong, but feels the same one that went bad in other threads on this forum

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:18 am
by Hombre71
Hombre71 wrote:
mazzinia wrote:you could try

test i2c

maybe helps to identify the one having troubles. But I "think" having read on this forum that i2c chips can give errors either if faulty, or if not receiving the +5v


Code: Select all

001a01-L1>test i2cError reading the NODE 0 DS1780 Company ID, bus 68 addr 0x2c -                                                                                                                             no acknowledge

error -1 on tst.
001a01-L1>


Yeahh...so I ordered 3 replacement DS1780 chips from AVNET EU. Now to find someone that can do SMD soldering in my area...

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:39 am
by jan-jaap
I'd like to figure out how NODE0 ... NODE2 map to the three DS1780 chips on the mainboard. I've got a cranky Fuel myself, and I'd rather not swap thta DS1780 between the PCI slots unless there was no other option.

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:47 am
by Hombre71
jan-jaap wrote:I'd like to figure out how NODE0 ... NODE2 map to the three DS1780 chips on the mainboard. I've got a cranky Fuel myself, and I'd rather not swap thta DS1780 between the PCI slots unless there was no other option.


Is yours complaining about a specific node # ? Because the hard way would be just to replace 1 by 1 the other two, plug the board
into power and run the L1 to see if it keeps complaining....

If you can do your own soldering then that would take some time but it would not be wasted....

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 5:17 am
by jan-jaap
This is really at the limit of what I can do by hand, but I'll try sometime soon (I have the chips).

I guess you could remove one and apply power to see which one "disappears" from the L1.

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:49 am
by mazzinia
mmmm before removing the chips , what about checking the current on the pins that should have Vdd etc ? ( the chip schematics are online ) ( this is for the OP )
This to triplecheck that the issue is a chip, and not something prior elsewhere.

And... one chip should be on the backside of the mb.. are we sure that there's nothing that maybe moved there and is causing a short ?
Dunno... a dead spider ?

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:24 am
by Hombre71
mazzinia wrote:mmmm before removing the chips , what about checking the current on the pins that should have Vdd etc ? ( the chip schematics are online ) ( this is for the OP )
This to triplecheck that the issue is a chip, and not something prior elsewhere.

And... one chip should be on the backside of the mb.. are we sure that there's nothing that maybe moved there and is causing a short ?
Dunno... a dead spider ?


I can inspect it when I remove the motherboard eventually. But given the well documented demise of these chips all over
the place it seems likely that one of them called it quits.

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:26 pm
by kubatyszko
Hombre71 wrote:Hmmm, I just noticed this indeed

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>ALERT: Error initializing DS1780 0, no acknowledge

SGI SN1 L1 Controller
Firmware Image B: Rev. 1.10.12, Built 02/01/2002 14:40:22


Do based on the number 0 can we identify which one is likely to be toast?

Or is there another way to double check both(?) DS1780 chips through L1 command or other test?

Cheers


I suppose there should be a hint in which fans are reported as 'no acknowledge' as well :

Code: Select all

001a01-L1>fan
fan(s) are on.
fan 0 EXHAUST  rpm 0 (255).
fan 1 ERROR I2C:no acknowledge.
fan 2 ERROR I2C:no acknowledge.
fan 3 XIO 1    rpm 0 (255).
fan 4 XIO 2    rpm 0 (255).
fan 5 PS       rpm 0 (255).
001a01-L1>
[/quote]


If I had to *guess*, my bet would go on the DS1780 near the ATX socket or below it.

There are 4 of those chips in total:


    Between PCI slots

    Below the ATX socket (can't remember the precise location)

    Somewhere near the Yellow ST chip

    On the PIMM module.

I don't have reliable information on which chip monitors which voltages or fans.

Thing is that all those are simply MONITORING issues, disabling env monitoring (env off) should let you go further and boot the machine. If that doesn't happen then you do have bigger problem with either the PSU or some voltage regulation onboard.

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:01 am
by jan-jaap
kubatyszko wrote:There are 4 of those chips in total:


    Between PCI slots

    Below the ATX socket (can't remember the precise location)

    Somewhere near the Yellow ST chip

    On the PIMM module.

And there's a fifth on the VPro graphics card.

kubatyszko wrote:Thing is that all those are simply MONITORING issues, disabling env monitoring (env off) should let you go further and boot the machine. If that doesn't happen then you do have bigger problem with either the PSU or some voltage regulation onboard.

The DS1780 chips communicate with the L1 using I2C. I don't know what else is on the I2C bus (ID PROM chips?), but I2C problems can stop the system from booting.

Re: Fuel fixer uppper

Posted: Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:20 am
by kubatyszko
jan-jaap wrote:
kubatyszko wrote:There are 4 of those chips in total:


    Between PCI slots

    Below the ATX socket (can't remember the precise location)

    Somewhere near the Yellow ST chip

    On the PIMM module.

And there's a fifth on the VPro graphics card.

kubatyszko wrote:Thing is that all those are simply MONITORING issues, disabling env monitoring (env off) should let you go further and boot the machine. If that doesn't happen then you do have bigger problem with either the PSU or some voltage regulation onboard.

The DS1780 chips communicate with the L1 using I2C. I don't know what else is on the I2C bus (ID PROM chips?), but I2C problems can stop the system from booting.



Forgot about the vpro (my experimental fuel has no video card ;-) ).
Yes the id chip on both fuel Mb (8-pin eeprom in a socket near Ethernet port) and vpro(small 6pin dallas chip) are on I2C bus, not sure what else.