SGI VWS 320 VRM

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FlasBurn
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SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Fri Nov 11, 2016 7:22 am

Hi,

I´m looking to upgrade my VWS 320 to dual cpu, but for this I need a VRM. Now I found a 20772-45 VRM which should be 12V. Will this VRM work? What could happen if this isn´t the right VRM? Will I kill the motherboard?

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johnnym
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby johnnym » Fri Nov 11, 2016 11:16 am

FlasBurn wrote:Now I found a 20772-45 VRM which should be 12V. Will this VRM work?

That depends on the Intel VRM revision and the used/supported CPUs of the system board (check update at the bottom). I'm not familiar with the Visual Workstation 320, but I've read that it supports both Pentium II and Pentium III CPUs (some system board revisions seem to even support the last generation of Pentium III processors). I assume the first Pentium II CPUs used by Silicon Graphics in this machine were of the Deschutes generation. For Pentium III there were Katmai, Coppermine and Tualatin.

Back to the VRM revision: for Coppermine CPUs (1.6 V, 1.65 V, 1.70 V, 1.75 V) you need VRM 8.4 (see page 9 for supported core voltages), for Katmai (2.0 V, 2.05 V) and Deschutes (2.0 V) you can do with VRM 8.3 (see page 8 for supported core voltages) and possibly below VRM 8.3, but I couldn't find any design guidelines for VRMs below revision 8.3. For VRM 8.3 voltages below 1.8 V are optional, so you cannot be sure if a specific VRM 8.3 compatible voltage regulation module will support Coppermine CPUs. For Katmai and Deschutes VRM 8.4 should or could also work, assuming those CPUs don't draw a higher current than the Coppermines.

Sometimes the VRM revision is "printed" on the VRM PCB. To be sure you should check the datasheet for the used voltage regulator IC, it should mention which VRM revision it supports. If your VRM is the same as this one, check the IC on the small PCB between the capacitors.

Hope this helps

UPDATE:
The release notes for PROM revision 1.1005 give some information about the system board requirements for specific CPU upgrades (below "Processor Upgrade Guidelines").
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FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:28 pm

I will just buy the VRM and try it out. I think it is a revision 8.4, but I´m not sure.

FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Wed Nov 16, 2016 2:01 pm

So I got the VRM module today and what can I say, it does not really work :(

The VWS starts, but it hangs when starting Windows 2000 and even when I try to reinstall Windows.

So I have to look further.

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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby GL1zdA » Wed Nov 16, 2016 2:12 pm

I couldn't find any info on the "20772-45" part, only found a datasheet for "20772-01" which is VRM 8.4 so it should work with any Slot 1 CPU. What was the exact configuration (CPUs and VRMs) of your 320 before you tried adding the second CPU/VRM?
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FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:33 pm

I´ve got an 117 board and I have at the moment a 850MHz PIII without a VRM. I then added the VRM and a second 850MHz PIII.

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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby johnnym » Wed Nov 16, 2016 11:59 pm

FlasBurn wrote:I´ve got an 117 board and I have at the moment a 850MHz PIII without a VRM. I then added the VRM and a second 850MHz PIII.


The VWS still works with the CPU that was originally installed, right?

To check if the second CPU is working, you could just exchange the original CPU against the second CPU, leaving the second Slot 1 and the VRM slot empty.

As both CPUs seem to not work together, it could be that they have a different maybe incompatible stepping. If you compare the voltages printed on both CPUs (top side of the Slot 1 module, something like "850/256/100/1.65V S1"), are both identical? There have been 1.7 V and 1.65 V Pentium III 850 available (see Pentium III 850 @ cpu-world.com). If they differ in the voltage, they also differ in the stepping.

What does the POST screen say? I don't remember, but Windows NT 4.0 showed all processors in a blue screen on startup, isn't that the same early when Windows 2000 is booting? If yes, do you see both processors listed there?
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[ ( hp ) ] 712/80 c3000 (dead) :hpserv: (J5600) c3700 c3750 c8000 rp2470 :rx2600: (rx2620) rx4640
| d | i | g | i | t | a | l | AXPpci33 AlphaStation 200 AlphaStation 255 PWS 500au AlphaServer DS20E AlphaServer DS25
C O B A L T Qube 2 Qube 3 RaQ RaQ 2 RaQ 4r RaQ XTR

FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:44 am

Both CPUs are working and both have the same stepping. The CPUs are recognized by the ARCS, but neither can I boot up my installed Windows 2000 nor can I install it.

So my assumption is, that there is something wrong with the VRM. Especially as I don´t really know the specs.

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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby johnnym » Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:40 am

FlasBurn wrote:Both CPUs are working and both have the same stepping. The CPUs are recognized by the ARCS, but neither can I boot up my installed Windows 2000 nor can I install it.

Not sure if this thread is useful, but there it is recommended to try a fresh disk and/or another installation CDROM disk. But I assume your Windows 2000 installation "just worked" before the installation of the second CPU. So it looks like the error is related to the second CPU and possibly the VRM and not your other hardware.

BTW, does your installed Windows 2000 (still) work with both CPUs installed respectively as single processor only?

FlasBurn wrote:So my assumption is, that there is something wrong with the VRM. Especially as I don´t really know the specs.

Couldn't you find a data sheet for the voltage regulator IC on the VRM?
:Indy: :O2: :Octane: :Octane2: :O200: = :O200: - :O200: = :O200: (O200 cluster w/2 GIGAchannel cabinets)
[ ( hp ) ] 712/80 c3000 (dead) :hpserv: (J5600) c3700 c3750 c8000 rp2470 :rx2600: (rx2620) rx4640
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C O B A L T Qube 2 Qube 3 RaQ RaQ 2 RaQ 4r RaQ XTR

FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Fri Nov 18, 2016 10:33 am

johnnym wrote:BTW, does your installed Windows 2000 (still) work with both CPUs installed respectively as single processor only?

I´m not really sure what you mean here. My installation works with 1 cpu only. When I install a second cpu, Windows will hang at the boot screen.

johnnym wrote:
FlasBurn wrote:So my assumption is, that there is something wrong with the VRM. Especially as I don´t really know the specs.

Couldn't you find a data sheet for the voltage regulator IC on the VRM?

Nope.

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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby johnnym » Fri Nov 18, 2016 11:10 am

FlasBurn wrote:
johnnym wrote:BTW, does your installed Windows 2000 (still) work with both CPUs installed respectively as single processor only?

I´m not really sure what you mean here. My installation works with 1 cpu only. When I install a second cpu, Windows will hang at the boot screen.

I meant, if your installation also works if you only use the additional CPU (not the original one!) in the first CPU slot and no CPU installed in the second CPU slot and no VRM installed? If your installed Windows 2000 or a Windows 2000 installation process works OK with the second CPU installed only, I'd assume that this CPU is "really" OK. I don't know if you already tested this. I try to rule out a possibly defective CPU here.

I believe I had a case in the past where I had two Pentium III 800 in an IBM NetFinity 5000, but one was broken. Although with both installed the system did work somewhat but crashed often, but when using only the broken one the machine didn't work at all.
:Indy: :O2: :Octane: :Octane2: :O200: = :O200: - :O200: = :O200: (O200 cluster w/2 GIGAchannel cabinets)
[ ( hp ) ] 712/80 c3000 (dead) :hpserv: (J5600) c3700 c3750 c8000 rp2470 :rx2600: (rx2620) rx4640
| d | i | g | i | t | a | l | AXPpci33 AlphaStation 200 AlphaStation 255 PWS 500au AlphaServer DS20E AlphaServer DS25
C O B A L T Qube 2 Qube 3 RaQ RaQ 2 RaQ 4r RaQ XTR

FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Fri Nov 18, 2016 1:16 pm

Yeah, I also tested this, but I can retry.

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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby armanox » Fri Nov 18, 2016 7:11 pm

If you can, see if the NT 4.0 installer will load. The one we had in university (dual P3) never did run quite right in Windows 2000, had to fall back to NT 4 SP6 to get everything running right (and 2K would also randomly BSOD on us as well).
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby johnnym » Sat Nov 19, 2016 12:33 am

FlasBurn wrote:Yeah, I also tested this, but I can retry.

Although according to the description possibly not related to your configuration, you could examine if the following makes a difference in your case:

from https://web.archive.org/web/20040910113 ... gi/CPU.htm
Disable the CPU's L2 ECC in the PROM System Settings. This is optional if the CPU upgrade is causing 'display artifacts', random crashes during bootup, disappearing icons and applications refusing to run.
:Indy: :O2: :Octane: :Octane2: :O200: = :O200: - :O200: = :O200: (O200 cluster w/2 GIGAchannel cabinets)
[ ( hp ) ] 712/80 c3000 (dead) :hpserv: (J5600) c3700 c3750 c8000 rp2470 :rx2600: (rx2620) rx4640
| d | i | g | i | t | a | l | AXPpci33 AlphaStation 200 AlphaStation 255 PWS 500au AlphaServer DS20E AlphaServer DS25
C O B A L T Qube 2 Qube 3 RaQ RaQ 2 RaQ 4r RaQ XTR

FlasBurn
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Re: SGI VWS 320 VRM

Unread postby FlasBurn » Wed Dec 21, 2016 8:41 am

Ok, so I tried all different VRMs I could get, but none of them worked. I still need to make a list which VRMs I tried, but what I don´t get is the different results I get even with the same VRM.

If a VRM isn´t working at all I just get a black screen. If it works in some way I can get into the PROM, but booting Windows 2000 will fail at different stages.
Either it hangs at the boot screen or I get one out of 2 different blue screens.
If I try to install Windows 2000 it is every time the same. When the setup says it is starting Windows 2000 it will hang. But one time I got as far as that it seemed that the setup could start Windows 2000, but then I got a screen with lines of different colors.

So at the moment I guess this is not a problem of the VRM, but a problem of my hardware. My first guess would be the psu. How can I detect a failing psu?
My second guess would be that the CPUs are the problem, but why should they?!


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