Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

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Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Y888099 » Tue May 30, 2017 3:47 am

s0ke wrote:Im getting out of the everything scene. Basically trying to widdle everything down to just a laptop


Welcome to the desert truth of reality: switching On and Off an old SGI machine is funny for the first sixty six minutes and six seconds. Then ... when you realize there is no good software ... it becomes boring, like the electricity bill you have to pay (especially for those who own 1-Kwatt machines, Onyx2?), and space wasted by an object which is less useful than a brick to stop the door.

But collectors see it differently. They don't need to find software, their purpose is just *to own* the last winter-heater. I suppose because in winter and autumn it's so cold and rainy outside, where they live.

So we have two kind of minds: purpose-driven, and collectors(1).

Supposing you are a purpose-driven, I suppose your laptop comes with more useful software. Ain't it? It was the same for me: sold my SGI for the same reason!


(1) well, I am also a collector, in a different way. I mean I prefer collecting spores and mushrooms. Dead organic matter useful for biological purposes, instead of dead metals which are only useful to decorate the attic.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby dexter1 » Tue May 30, 2017 4:17 am

Y888099 wrote:Welcome to the desert truth of reality...

s0ke has decided to part with his machine, that is entirely his decision resulting from his reasoning. I guess everybody else will have some sort of opinion about this, but i have no inclination to see these kinds of discussions in a hardware for sale thread.

If you want to discuss his decision, PM him or start a thread somewhere in everything else.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Y888099 » Tue May 30, 2017 4:30 am

dexter1 wrote:If you want to discuss his decision, PM him or start a thread somewhere in everything else.


So, in this forum you have to send PM to keep things private, isn't odds you have to keep discussion private?
For sure, I don't want to open a topic to discuss anything regarding a simple comment. It will be a waste of time like talking about linux. Therefore once again, it was the last occasion lost to have a good mini-discussion, born accidentally, which should have handled with a few comments.

Go on this way and you will see how fast people will leave the whole forum, which frankly, already looks like a desert.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Hakimoto » Tue May 30, 2017 7:14 am

@s0ke: As to the original topic, I went minimal in 2007. I run one seriously capable laptop and four OSen on it. Haven't regretted it. Yes, I miss the big ol' iron sometimes, but maybe one day we'll have Indy emulation. I hope you will be happy with your decision, you're certainly not alone with it! ;) Hope Redmenace finds a good home!

As for the rest, my sincere apologies for hijacking your thread to post the below, but I really feel it's necessary (again).

Y888099 wrote:So, in this forum you have to send PM to keep things private, isn't odds you have to keep discussion private?


Did you actually read what dexter1 wrote?

dexter1 wrote:... i have no inclination to see these kinds of discussions in a hardware for sale thread. If you want to discuss his decision, PM him or start a thread somewhere in everything else.


I think that's quite specific advice (again) on how these forums work. It's the "Hardware For Sale/Trade" forum. Compare Raion-Fox's two times two (short) lines of comment and your ever so slightly more extensive post. Thence dexter1's advice that if you want to discuss this at such length to either PM s0ke or address his motivations in detail in a new thread in "Everything Else" where it's not as OT as it very quickly becomes here.

For the record, you're not the only person who's been discouraged from OT discussions in the (rather specific) Bazaar subforums (or elsewhere for that matter).

Y888099 wrote:For sure, I don't want to open a topic to discuss anything regarding a simple comment.


The point is that going OT in posts in this subforum is discouraged, whether you like it or not.

Y888099 wrote:It will be a waste of time like talking about linux. Therefore once again, it was the last occasion lost to have a good mini-discussion, born accidentally, which should have handled with a few comments.


OT. Not about s0ke's motivations. Not even about the same topic. Just another exposition of how you are dissatisfied with these forums and how they are moderated. That is why dexter1 offered you the advice.

Y888099 wrote:Go on this way and you will see how fast people will leave the whole forum, which frankly, already looks like a desert.


Actually, in (my) fourteen years of moderating here, we've had very few people who have found our way of doing things around here as unreasonable as you seem to find it. Which means that (nearly) everyone else is still here.

I strongly suggest you start here: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc1855 (Yeah, that's netiquette, from 1995!)
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that you were touching the future years before the rest of
the world. And that other computers and operating systems
will do with brute force what the Amiga did years before with
grace, elegance and style.


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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby kramlq » Tue May 30, 2017 8:46 am

Hakimoto wrote:... we've had very few people who have found our way of doing things around here as unreasonable as you seem to find it. Which means that (nearly) everyone else is still here.

Mods, you must be doing something right. Even some who got banned, and demanded deletion of all their postings, thus wrecking many, many threads, eventually came back under a different name. I'd say it was quite gracious of everybody to just say "Ciao" once again, and not make too much of a fuss about the past.

[With apologies to s0ke for further distracting from the thread - someone please buy his Fuel so the thread can be locked :-)]

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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby s0ke » Tue May 30, 2017 9:45 am

kramlq wrote:[With apologies to s0ke for further distracting from the thread - someone please buy his Fuel so the thread can be locked :-)]


Yes please.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby spiroyster » Tue May 30, 2017 10:15 am

Y888099 wrote:So, in this forum you have to send PM to keep things private

Dang, I've being doing it wrong all these years. :roll:

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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Y888099 » Wed May 31, 2017 2:57 am

Hakimoto wrote:Actually, in (my) fourteen years of moderating here


*Actually* if you ask people in private, a lot of people believe Dexter1 is one of the reason why this forum is a desert, and they all suggest him to be removed from the mods.

Ask to Hamei, for example. The last episode, the issued "user warning" against him, is an embarrassing example of why he should be removed.

We are (we should supposed to be?) all adults, so for me what happens here is irritating. Why was he punished? For a "dildo" word in one of his funny rants? Ridiculous, deserving of derision, like the bullshit you are trying to fill to justify his action.

Man, I am not interested in this silly questions, I have for sure more interesting business to do than babysitting people. Linux is also making me to go nuts, as well as my customers. This forum MUST be a relax break. It's the third time I get irritated. So, I have already moved my discussions on mail lists, and probably I will completely leave this place, which, is interesting ONLY for the bazaar area. Frankly, and since you love to shutdown people, everything else is boring, annoying as well as irritating, and there is also a level of bias here (e.g. against linux), which is also irritating.

End of the story. Bye.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby spiroyster » Wed May 31, 2017 4:08 am

Y888099 wrote:...the issued "user warning" against him...

If this was me? I apologise, For the record, I did not say that to get him banned. It was a tongue and cheek warning suggesting some linux advocates (ironically you came to mind at the time) might find it offensive and start flaming.

He has been banned on more than one occasion in the last few years and it seems like he might be used to this regular sabbatical. However, he keeps coming back, and tbh I glad he does. I'm sure if 'they' really wanted him gone, the admin hammer would come down, and not go back up again!

Personally, I think the moderators do a good job. They could be a lot stricter, however this place has always had a character and banter which is loosely coupled with the main subject matter (which I personally consider a higher calibre than a lot of other 'hang-outs'). There are other ‘venues’ on the interweb which have modbots removing all human aspects of moderation. I can’t imagine what an oasis of culture those places are, but there would be no discretion at least.

As been said, your rant is not un-welcome in the forum, just not here in someone else’s FS thread since it's suggesting what OP's motives are and could be considered directly devaluing OP by saying (in your opinion) what they are selling is worthless and unpractical. Putting this topic in ‘everything else’, could be considered coincidence, but certainly wouldn’t stand up in a court of law as being directly related to someone’s FS thread, which is perhaps why it was suggested? I don’t think there are many here who haven’t thought of the practicalities (pros/cons) of owning some of these beasts, for whatever reason they choose to have them.

I do like your rants, and you are clearly a smart guy, a lot of issues in your world appear to be beyond my calibre, however without stating the obvious...

If it's horse power you want, get an i9, be done with it... and have flame wars with Ryzen fanboys.

If its linux. There are linux forums (both generic, and distro flavoured) which would probably have your questions answered by the time you hit refresh on your browser.

If its old software beyond EOL... get off it now!, your customers will thank you in the future.

If its bespoke architectures, you are working with. The 'sherlock' aspect goes with the territory, questions welcome, however the probability of an answer is not as high unless it's an sgi... in which case there is no other place. Not saying you won't get answers, however I wouldn't ask a brain surgeon to fill out my offshore tax returns... or vice versa. If you get what I mean ;)

Y888099 wrote:Bye.

I don't think you should go, on an emotional note, personally, I would miss you (and as I said, do like your rants). On a practical note, there is only a finite amount of server space and creating new accounts all the time will only waste it and induce an unwanted puppet-like/schizophrenic experience for everybody else.

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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Hakimoto » Wed May 31, 2017 4:24 am

kramlq wrote:[With apologies to s0ke for further distracting from the thread - someone please buy his Fuel so the thread can be locked :-)]


Yes, please. :) So sorry for the hijack, s0ke, I really am. :(

Y888099 wrote:*Actually* if you ask people in private, a lot of people believe Dexter1 is one of the reason why this forum is a desert, and they all suggest him to be removed from the mods.


Actually, those who disagree with dexter1 on his moderating can and do get in touch with him publicly or via PM to discuss his motivations and are provided with reasons in line with forum policy. That not everyone agrees with forum policy is an entirely different matter.

I'm surprised you find this place deserted, btw. Seems quite lively to me. There were times when it was a lot more quiet than it is now. (But I guess historical experience doesn't count, right? ;) )

Y888099 wrote:Ask to Hamei, for example. The last episode, the issued "user warning" against him, is an embarrassing example of why he should be removed.


Actually, hamei is a good friend and we're still in touch. He doesn't agree with forum policy (and doesn't have to) and saw fit to not dance along to the tune we play here, so he took his interests elsewhere. I'm not even going to attempt to shed light on the long line of underlying reasons because that would be... historical!

Y888099 wrote:We are (we should supposed to be?) all adults, so for me what happens here is irritating. Why was he punished? For a "dildo" word in one of his funny rants? Ridiculous, deserving of derision, like the bullshit you are trying to fill to justify his action.


You're welcome to use the search function to search for all of hamei's posts and then examine all his historical interactions with other members. Provided you have the patience for that, you will be able to find out why he chose to leave. Happy reading.

Y888099 wrote:Man, I am not interested in this silly questions, I have for sure more interesting business to do than babysitting people.


Funny you say that, because last I checked we were the ones doing the sitting.

Y888099 wrote:Linux is also making me to go nuts, as well as my customers.


Start a general rant in "Everything Else" or start a specific rant in "Miscellaneous Operating Systems/Hardware", as previously advised. ;)

Y888099 wrote:This forum MUST be a relax break. It's the third time I get irritated. So, I have already moved my discussions on mail lists, and probably I will completely leave this place, which, is interesting ONLY for the bazaar area. Frankly, and since you love to shutdown people, everything else is boring, annoying as well as irritating, and there is also a level of bias here (e.g. against linux), which is also irritating. End of the story. Bye.


As I said before, the number of people who get irritated here is (thankfully) quite low. We can't make everyone happy with the way we do things. Apparently especially you. Even with well-meant advice and friendly pointers when you came back after your first round of tantrum.

dexter1, the other mods, I, other users... everyone has offered you well-meant advice on how to go about posting certain things so as to increase your chances of receiving meaningful replies and decreasing the chances of being considered OT, disparaging or, worse, trolling. Maybe you really do want to take a hard look in the mirror and read that RFC I linked to for starters.

Practically every time someone points out to you how you could go about doing something differently you seem to take it as a personal attack, indicative of the low standards of our forum, enmity, bias and whatnot. I haven't had this much negativity from anyone in my fourteen years here. (Oh, sorry, apparently that's not relevant. ;) )
The Bandito wrote:In a few years, no doubt, you'll be able to buy a computer,
software and operating system that will match the capabilities
of your current Amiga at about the price you paid for the
Amiga way back when. But you can smile to yourself, knowing
that you were touching the future years before the rest of
the world. And that other computers and operating systems
will do with brute force what the Amiga did years before with
grace, elegance and style.


Eroteme.ch - my end of the internet...

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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby mopar5150 » Wed May 31, 2017 1:58 pm

I am a member of several different forums of various interests. In my view this is one of the more forgiving forums when it comes to bs. Most forums will listen to a few silly rants and then you are banned... period. And then when we realize that the same individual pops up again with a different name but same personality disorders they are banned without delay. People make mistakes or get fired up every now and then and that is life. Usually they post with an "I'm sorry" and all is forgiven.

The forum rules are very simple and clearly stated. The rest is just common courtesy.


Personally, I like Hamei and enjoyed the good and bad of his posts. :lol:

Just my $.02
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Raion-Fox » Wed May 31, 2017 3:12 pm

So wait a sec. I remember ivelegacy, the Italian guy who threatened everyone and then demanded all of his posts be deleted.

Is Y888099 him? I noticed the veiled references here but I didn't want to assume...
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby uunix » Wed May 31, 2017 11:44 pm

Raion-Fox wrote:So wait a sec. I remember ivelegacy, the Italian guy who threatened everyone and then demanded all of his posts be deleted.

Is Y888099 him? I noticed the veiled references here but I didn't want to assume...

Well his English improved somewhat, but his drug fuelled crazy ranting's remained the same.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby Krokodil » Thu Jun 01, 2017 11:36 am

The style of moderation here is decent. It could be far worse. Believe me.

I know of atleast one forum, where no criticism of the moderators is permitted at all. The posts never get posted and the topic is locked immediately with no explanation. They are not interested in listening, since emails about that behavior go ignored. They also interfere with peoples putting jerks in their place, instead of blocking the jerk from saying jerk things to someone else, they block the response to the jerk - making it look like the jerk was right in behaving like a jerk.

There was also another forum where the moderators and admin were extremely foul mouthed and unprofessional about their duties. People were frequently cussed out and banned for simply expressing disagreement with the establishment, or for even more trivial reasons than that. They had no problem utterly slandering, denigrating and lambasting the people they banned. That forum is now gone since the stupidity of the people running it, ran it right into the ground! Of course they blamed everyone but themselves for that.

And I can think of another one where the admin was a total dick, guy thought he was a blue wolf and abusing new members was common. Guy even threatened to give out someones personal information because they stole something out of an abandoned building...

So lets just be thankful that this place doesn't have any of those.
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Re: Netiquette, moderation, etc. (was FS: Fuel R16 700, 2G, V6)

Unread postby guardian452 » Fri Jun 02, 2017 6:19 am

Raion-Fox wrote:So wait a sec. I remember ivelegacy, the Italian guy who threatened everyone and then demanded all of his posts be deleted.

Is Y888099 him? I noticed the veiled references here but I didn't want to assume...


I sort of miss that guy who was supposedly from .nl, every 3rd word he typed was bolded or underlined etc :lol:


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