Vax 4000 model 108

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jc179
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:41 am
Location: Ancaster, Ontario, Canada

Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby jc179 » Fri Jan 24, 2014 1:54 pm

Well folks, this thing has been a learning curve for sure! I wanted to follow up to my previous post; but I seem to have mixed two machines into one post...clever... derp. Decided to start another post for this and keep it seperated, if I can control my self :)

I recently started tinkering with the Vax 4000 again, after it sat idle for a while. The onboard battery pooped out (literally leaked blue/green gunk out), and I suspect my troubles *could* be related to whatever parameter was lost, or perhaps the part is now dead. The board wasn't damaged luckly, and I cleaned up the old connector (replaced it actually) and installed a new rechargable 1.2v x 3 cell pack.

Btw, old post viewtopic.php?f=18&t=17436 to which I am referring to where SAQ identified this thing! - thanks again for the help!

So when powering up the machine, it stops consistently at test #30.

eg:

KA57-A V1.0, VMB 2.16
Performing normal system tests.
74..73..72..71..70..69..68..67..66..65..64..63..62..61..60..59..
58..57..56..55..54..53..52..51..50..49..48..47..46..45..44..43..
42..41..40..39..38..37..36..35..34..33..32..31..30..

^ sits there forever and doesn't move beyond. Doesn't respond to console input.



I have narrowed it down to when I remove a logic board, it goes past this and proceeds to boot normally.
That logic board inside which sits on the only backwards, and offset "PCI" slot. (On left hand of the screen, there are 2 cards standing up right, it is the longer card that is double, on the right side).
See this picture:
download/file.php?id=1271&mode=view

I've looked at the pdf http://manx.classiccmp.org/collections/ ... 108uia.pdf

T 9E

Test #30 is :

30 200637BC Memory_Init_Bitmap *** mark_Hard_SBEs ******

If a parameter can be assigned a value, the name of the parameter is shown in the
parameters column in (t9e).
You can use test 9E with the test number as a parameter to show a list of legal
parameters and valid values for the test number. For example, enter T 9E 30 to
show a list of legal parameters and valid values for test number 30
(Memory_Init_Bitmap).


This board is some "synchronous logic" per the label on the circut board, question is, what is it suppose to do?

Sticking the part# into google only returns the name which I already know :(


Any ideas / suggestions what I can do to further troubleshoot? Some of the talk in the manual suggests there is another console port on the internal card you need to connect to, and setup? I don't see anything... :roll:

Cheers

Jonathan
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

SAQ
Posts: 5871
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Renton, WA

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby SAQ » Sun Feb 09, 2014 7:05 pm

I will tell you that the battery is not needed for bootup - I've started preemptively pulling them on mine, and the 4000/200 doesn't have a battery anymore yet still boots (it was from the era where NiCDs were "in", and they like to leak).

I don't have anything as new as the /108, so can't verify that.

The double card looks like the QBus card. It allows you to connect an external QBus chassis for I/O. I don't think you need it - the /108 should have all base I/O onboard through the "CVAX bus"
"Brakes??? What Brakes???"

"I am O SH-- the Great and Powerful"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)

SAQ
Posts: 5871
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Renton, WA

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby SAQ » Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:16 am

Wait - I'm not sure about that ID. Can you get a better picture of the double-card? (including the connector and the boards/2 shots if possible)

DEC changed some of the connectors on the later /100 VAXes. I'm pretty sure it's an optional card, though.
"Brakes??? What Brakes???"

"I am O SH-- the Great and Powerful"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)

SAQ
Posts: 5871
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Renton, WA

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby SAQ » Tue Feb 11, 2014 7:24 am

Pretty sure it's a serial interface. Looks like DEC used a 108 and later-/100 series specific connector on them so it would fit in a standard PC I/O bulkhead. If that's what it is it will be a 120-pin connector (slightly bigger than a Origin NUMAlink but with pins instead of the ribbon connector, or significantly longer than a HD68 SCSI but similar in looks). It might be synchronous serial (almost definitely useless) or asynchronous serial (probably useless unless you need more ports than the builtin 4-or-so).

Unless you have the breakout cable you can't use either - go ahead and pull it.
Last edited by SAQ on Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Brakes??? What Brakes???"

"I am O SH-- the Great and Powerful"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)

SAQ
Posts: 5871
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Renton, WA

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby SAQ » Tue Feb 11, 2014 2:03 pm

Do you have model numbers for the card and the one next to it (SCSI or DSSI - not exactly sure which). Your setup looks a bit different from the ordinary, which has a DSSI adaptor feeding a HSD10 DSSI-SCSI converter/RAID controller. If it is DSSI without the HSD then things get difficult.

I think the SCSI connector on the mainboard is backfed from the HSD controller usually installed on the CDAL planar (I/O planar) as well, so you might not have any SCSI interfaces.
"Brakes??? What Brakes???"

"I am O SH-- the Great and Powerful"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)

jc179
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:41 am
Location: Ancaster, Ontario, Canada

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby jc179 » Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:38 am

thanks for the info SAQ! I've pulled them and seems successful so far.

The info off the larger card which has a daughterboard is as follows:


Larger card:

"Sync Loginc 5424709" , also have "5024708-01 B01" and 54-24709-01.

Daughter board has "sync logic" "50-20639-01 D1 L7", and "5420640" and "54-20640-01", and has a MC68302FC16C cpu / w large eprom. matches "http://www.ebay.ca/itm/DEC-54-20640-01-EIA232-Sync-ADAPTER-MicroVAX-3100-Card-/350177747899"

The scsi looking card has

'50-24710-01 B01" , "54-24711-01"

Cheers

Jonathan
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb

SAQ
Posts: 5871
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:37 am
Location: Renton, WA

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby SAQ » Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:56 pm

Looks like the problem card is a synchronous serial interface that you will probably never use even if it did work. Mark it bad and get rid of it.

Your other card is a KZDDA SCSI add-in. Probably not as fast as the DSSI+HSD10 that the machine would have originally came with, but it will work. "show dev" will tell you where your disk is so you don't need to worry about finding it blind. Looks like there is another SCSI adapter on the CDAL planar as well that you can use.

Have fun with the box, and keep the VAX maxim in mind: "Nothing is industry standard until proven to be so beyond a reasonable doubt"
"Brakes??? What Brakes???"

"I am O SH-- the Great and Powerful"

:Indigo: :Octane: :Indigo2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indy: :PI: :O3x0: :ChallengeL: :O2000R: (single-CM)

jc179
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:41 am
Location: Ancaster, Ontario, Canada

Re: Vax 4000 model 108

Unread postby jc179 » Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:28 am

As always thanks so much for the helpful response SAQ! Will save a few useful bits off the card and toss it !

Other than that the machine seems to run well, and has been posting every time!

Jonathan
Indigo2 R10K 200 Mhz, 512 MB, Max Impact
O2 R12K 270 Mhz, 256 MB
Indy R5k 180 Mhz, XL24, 256MB
Sun Ultra1 Creator UltrasparcI 167 Mhz, 1 GB, 64bit, Custom Solaris 10 inst
Sun 280R dual 750 Mhz UltrasparcIII, 2GB
D1000 Disk array, LSI Logic FC array, Sun T3
Octane 195 Mhz single, mxe
Vax 4000 model 108, 256 mb
Alpha 500au, 18g, 512mb


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