Incorrect dependency issues?

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Trippynet
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Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby Trippynet » Mon Nov 24, 2014 12:45 pm

Hallo, I've come across a rather strange issue with my Indigo2 the other day. I was installing a few bits and bobs from Nekoware beta (namely ScummVM, plus a few other bits) and I was getting a number of missing dependencies. Nothing strange about that, but many of these were core libraries which I'm sure are installed (neko_libpng, neko_flac, neko_libvorbis, that kind of thing). Anyway, I grabbed them again, added them to software manager, and that confirmed I had the latest version - and that the necessary sub-components were installed (everything but source code), but still the dependency issues remained.

Tried it with some of the beta versions, and although Software Manager spotted the upgraded versions, I still got the dependency errors for the package I was trying to install. In the end I resorted to using inst, turned "set rulesoverride on", then forced the install of ScummVM, and lo and behold, it works absolutely fine (because all of the dependencies were actually installed).

So! Any idea why these are reported as missing when they're obviously installed? I could of course just resort to bypassing the checks every time, but I know they're there for a reason and would like to understand why they're wrongly failing.
Systems in use:
:Indigo2IMP: - Nitrogen: R10000 195MHz CPU, 384MB RAM, SolidIMPACT Graphics, 36GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 100Mb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.22
:Fuel: - Lithium: R14000 600MHz CPU, 4GB RAM, V10 Graphics, 72GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 1Gb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.30
Other system in storage: :O2: R5000 200MHz, 224MB RAM, 72GB 15k HDD, PSU fan mod, IRIX 6.5.30

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Mon Nov 24, 2014 5:35 pm

Trippynet wrote:So! Any idea why these are reported as missing when they're obviously installed?

Take the distribution files from the tardist that's giving a problem (it's either in the .spec or .idb, I forget which), look at the "versions required" and compare against what you have installed. "ver foo" in Irix will tell you the version you have installed.

I'm going to guess that your problem child was accidentally built against some newer versions than what we have in nekoware ?
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby Trippynet » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:50 am

Thanks, I'll give that a shot.
Systems in use:
:Indigo2IMP: - Nitrogen: R10000 195MHz CPU, 384MB RAM, SolidIMPACT Graphics, 36GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 100Mb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.22
:Fuel: - Lithium: R14000 600MHz CPU, 4GB RAM, V10 Graphics, 72GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 1Gb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.30
Other system in storage: :O2: R5000 200MHz, 224MB RAM, 72GB 15k HDD, PSU fan mod, IRIX 6.5.30

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby foetz » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:52 am

hamei wrote:I'm going to guess that your problem child was accidentally built against some newer versions than what we have in nekoware ?

inst dependencies are not related to the actual content of the package. they're set manually so even if the actual software was built against other libs it wouldn't affect the deps set for gendist in any way.
might just be a typo but not possible to tell unless we know which ones were affected i.e. Trippynet tells us exactly what the errors were

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Tue Nov 25, 2014 2:14 am

foetz wrote:inst dependencies are not related to the actual content of the package. they're set manually so even if the actual software was built against other libs it wouldn't affect the deps set for gendist in any way.

What I meant was, what has happened in the past is that some people build their own private tardists for dependencies. This upgrades their local versions. Then they make a tardist for nekoware but forget they have upgraded version numbers on their buildbox.

So, 'versions required' are then set manually (or by a script ?) but if you forget that your own libraries are newer than nekoware libraries, then the versions you require will also be higher than nekoware versions.

Hope that made sense :(

If it's wrong, feel free to kick my ass :P

might just be a typo but not possible to tell unless we know which ones were affected i.e. Trippynet tells us exactly what the errors were

Ja, he needs to check the versions required against what's available. It could also be a typo in the tardist he's installing, you're right.

Or it could be something else entirely ... perhaps root doesn't have /usr/nekoware in its path ? I'd maybe also try a 'which foo' as root to see if swmgr can find those libaries .....

Does inst give more feedback than the graphical software manager ?
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby foetz » Tue Nov 25, 2014 12:38 pm

hamei wrote:What I meant was, what has happened in the past is that some people build their own private tardists for dependencies. This upgrades their local versions. Then they make a tardist for nekoware but forget they have upgraded version numbers on their buildbox.

yup i got it but it's wrong hehe

So, 'versions required' are then set manually (or by a script ?) but if you forget that your own libraries are newer than nekoware libraries, then the versions you require will also be higher than nekoware versions.

no, that's not how it works :P
for every inst package you create the deps manually by entering the name of the dep, the min and max version and so on. so what you actually have installed is irrelevant.

Or it could be something else entirely ... perhaps root doesn't have /usr/nekoware in its path ? I'd maybe also try a 'which foo' as root to see if swmgr can find those libaries .....

no, inst doesn't check if the stuff is actually there. it only looks at the deps listed in the package.

Does inst give more feedback than the graphical software manager ?

both are the same. swmgr is just a gui on top of inst

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Tue Nov 25, 2014 8:40 pm

foetz wrote:yup i got it but it's wrong hehe

Hao de, let me expose my ignorance :oops: and run some ecc on the meat ram ...

What I have done is

1) build the application, let's call it Boozer 6.9
2) run it for a while to see if it works
3) pretty good program, let's share
4) many times it's an upgrade, so grab the previous nekoware dist files and release notes for Boozer 6.3
5) upgrade the release notes
6) make a new tardist with the updated goodies

to do that, I'll pull the older spec file

versions.jpg

and update it with the levels from

versions_dash_n.jpg

This will reflect what the program was actually built against. Here's the kicker ... I have some tardists that I made for myself. They aren't good enough to upload to nekoware. But when I do < versions -n > I'm going to get the higher version numbers and use those as requirements. I'm not going to spend hours trying to figure out if an older version will work.

That's killed my contributions to nekoware until (if) we get newer freetype and gtk2 tardists.

Enlighten me as to what I am doing wrong. I'd really like to be better at this :oops:

(Boy, running showprods was an eye-opener ... I need to remove a bunch of stuff I never ever use !)
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby foetz » Tue Nov 25, 2014 9:52 pm

hamei wrote:But when I do < versions -n > I'm going to get the higher version numbers and use those as requirements.

haha of course if you take the version numbers of other packages then it's not gonna match but i doubt you'd call your "internal" stuff neko_* :P
anyway the description looks all fine :-)

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Tue Nov 25, 2014 10:32 pm

foetz wrote: i doubt you'd call your "internal" stuff neko_* :P

In fact, I do. I tried it a couple other ways but it was just too much clutter. Pieces spread everywhere ... so now, even if it's just for me, everything goes in /usr/nekoware ...

Was going to look at the scummvm thing but wa ! 30 megabytes just to check the spec file, better not :shock:
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby foetz » Wed Nov 26, 2014 1:25 am

hamei wrote:
foetz wrote: i doubt you'd call your "internal" stuff neko_* :P

In fact, I do. I tried it a couple other ways but it was just too much clutter. Pieces spread everywhere ... so now, even if it's just for me, everything goes in /usr/nekoware ...

ohmy what a mess :P
well in that case you indeed need to check each package if it's "real" before adding the deps

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Wed Nov 26, 2014 6:02 pm

foetz wrote:ohmy what a mess :P

It weas a mess the other way, too. There's no free lunch :(

At least nekoware is not exactly a moving target :mrgreen:
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby Trippynet » Sun Nov 30, 2014 7:48 am

Finally had chance to have a play with this again (during the week is usually too busy with work things etc). Looks like hamei has hit the nail on the head...

So, ScummVM complains about the following missing dependencies on my system:

neko_flac (ver 4+, I have v3 - which is from Neko beta)
neko_freetype2 (ver 19+, I have v17 - also from Neko beta)
neko_libpng (ver 11+, I have v10 - another Neko beta version)
neko_libvorbis (ver 2+, I have v1, again the latest from beta)
neko_zlib (ver 8+, and I have v7 and there isn't a newer one in beta)

Looks like whoever built the beta version of ScummVM has a lot of newer compiled bits and pieces than are available on Nekoware. Overall, I'm not frightfully bothered as it's easy enough to get around by forcing rulesoverride, but I guess this is a package which is most definitely not ready to be moved out of beta!

Thanks everyone. I mainly wanted to understand exactly why it was happening, and be sure that there was nothing wrong with my Indigo2 :)
Systems in use:
:Indigo2IMP: - Nitrogen: R10000 195MHz CPU, 384MB RAM, SolidIMPACT Graphics, 36GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 100Mb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.22
:Fuel: - Lithium: R14000 600MHz CPU, 4GB RAM, V10 Graphics, 72GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 1Gb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.30
Other system in storage: :O2: R5000 200MHz, 224MB RAM, 72GB 15k HDD, PSU fan mod, IRIX 6.5.30

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby hamei » Sun Nov 30, 2014 7:57 pm

Trippynet wrote: I guess this is a package which is most definitely not ready to be moved out of beta!

If it works well for you even with the lower-level versions, then a simple change to the spec file would fix it. You could open a < beta: ScummVM > thread.
I spent a fortune on booze, birds, and fast cars ... the rest I just squandered

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Re: Incorrect dependency issues?

Unread postby Trippynet » Mon Dec 01, 2014 4:44 am

I'll have to have a proper play with it first to see if everything else is working OK. I only got as far as launching it and loading up a game. This did work, but there's probably a fair bit more to test with it. I'll see what I can do and if it's all good then I'll look at opening a thread so it can be fixed and then possibly moved to current.
Systems in use:
:Indigo2IMP: - Nitrogen: R10000 195MHz CPU, 384MB RAM, SolidIMPACT Graphics, 36GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 100Mb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.22
:Fuel: - Lithium: R14000 600MHz CPU, 4GB RAM, V10 Graphics, 72GB 15k HDD & 300GB 10k HDD, 1Gb/s NIC, New/quiet fans, IRIX 6.5.30
Other system in storage: :O2: R5000 200MHz, 224MB RAM, 72GB 15k HDD, PSU fan mod, IRIX 6.5.30


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