SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

3D/2D CGI and the tools used in their creation (Maya, Photoshop, Blender, GIMP, etc.).
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spiroyster
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby spiroyster » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:16 am

RobhG wrote:spiroyster, SGI was used in Nintendo Wii games, I refer to the Octane 2 Workstation onwards are the only ones to work on commercially current CGI as Tezro.

I'm sure it was/is/will be.

Enough of this though, tell me about directly yielding Maya 2017 with a non otoy octane.

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby praetor242 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:21 am

I think if you're starting out with CGI with no experience (like me), having an SGI is a good starting place since what was happening then, set the precedent for what's happening now. Plus the software is free-ish (if you don't mind doing nebulous things). I can't afford the $1400/yr subscription for Maya. And even if I could, I couldn't justify it because I don't know how to use Maya. I can learn on my SGI, take those skills and apply them to a modern package if I feel the purchase is justifiable. I don't expect to make the next Avatar. But I can make fun little things to put on my Facebook and learn the package. That's where the value and practicality lands for me.

The other thing, for me at least, is I'm a systems engineer. Not an artist. I got my start in UNIX umpteen years ago on an SGI Indy at the University of Wyoming and I've mostly had an SGI machine, sans a 5 year gap, since then. It's still the most productive UNIX environment I've ever used. I have a fancy $3000 iMac and I still prefer working in IRIX.
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:45 am

praetor242, Must be cheating, I already look CGI works done in SGI from 2003 to 2006? If you know how to use, nothing will leave you behind even more with a SGI where it accepts high polygons and great animation without many frills or full of errors and besides, the best version of Maya is 6.5 and 8.0, Softimage 3d is 4.0 released in 2002 , both have high renderers and join the 2, you will have a CGI monster. I have a question, SGI Octane 2 has any problem with super heating or not??

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby Raion-Fox » Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:44 am

Irinikus wrote:It's quite interesting to see the negativity being expressed here, when it comes to rendering on SGI's (for nostalgia of course).

The the only reason why I collect SGI's at all, is due to the significance that they had when it came to graphics and the thought and design processes which they introduced (the GE and rasterisation etc.) which ultimately lead to the modern GPU's which we use today.

If you want to experience an old school unix machine and aren't really interested in graphics, then why not just get yourself one of the DEC Alpha machines then?


Nobody (even Hamei) wants to express negativity unless it's absolutely warranted. And in this case, it really is warranted. The OP is under the impression that we're still in the early 2000's and that using antique hardware for commercial applications is viable. I mean, yes, there's people that still do it - I help maintain a small farm of Onyx2s for a company in Norfolk who does 3D rendering and I have first dibs if they ever get rid of their Onyx stuff - which is awesome.

Alphas cost far more for what you get. Go on eBay and price out a Tezro vs a 21364 powered Alphaserver. You will pay many times the Tezro for the Alphaserver, with no guarantees it'll work.

SGI's IRIX just happens to be one of the best desktop OSes ever designed. It's not perfect, but even with something like that 5dwm you can't replicate the feel on a modern OS. It just isn't currently possible.

RobhG wrote:Does SGI have a problem with super heating? Can I use pendrive?? So using SGI for current CGI is highly recommended or just another option for business work?


SGIs run hotter than a modern system generally speaking yes. You cannot use USB mass storage. Honestly, if I were to say use Maya on an SGI, it'd only be for initial design of the model, then import the models over NFS to a modern system to animate, render and do all of the heavy lifting. Considering GCC compilation on my Octane with all the optimizations ticked takes hours, and about 45-90 mins on my modern Haswell (and the noise the Haswell produces is far far quieter) you would be throwing away money using an SGI in a modern CGI studio. It would be a detriment to your workload and a liability in case it broke down.

RobhG wrote:spiroyster, SGI was used in Nintendo Wii games, I refer to the Octane 2 Workstation onwards are the only ones to work on commercially current CGI as Tezro.


And you know what the Wii's graphical capability is comparable to? The Microsoft XBOX - which has a GeForce 2MX in it. So again, I could probably model something MUCH faster on an army of XBOXes running XBOX Linux, and there are FAR better options than that!
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 11:14 am

It is different when it comes to SGI Octane 2 or Tezro for computer graphics, mainframe could have used Windows XP Professional and Maya, but have always used SGI to work on CGI from 1996 to 2006! Or maybe you've used years ahead of this, what I mean is: if you want to use SGI Octane 2 onwards for serious and commercial CGI jobs, you can use without doubt, even more with tools available and fast.

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby escimo » Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:36 pm

@RobhG
The HW shouldn't be the starting point for your decision, even if it seems you prefer SGI (IRIX) workstations. I recommend to look at what you want to achieve (result of you work). Then take a look at the software options (vendors, applications) with there individual feature spectrum and requirements for recommended HW. Finally choose the optimal HW and necessary OS.

A tried/planed several times buying of a workstation again after the first attempt back in 2000 with an Blade 100 desktop system (the only system I could afford). It was far better (response time) for Java development under -OMG - Forte Developer 1.0 IDE and more reasonable than a Pentium 3 / Win2k combination at this time. An Ultra 40 with Opteron was never aquirred and I ended up in buying a MacBook Pro 2011 because the focus shifted. Actually I have nothing to do with Java anymore but with post processing of RAW images (photography). But I need 75% also some kind of GNU/Linux to work with (virtualization, cloud svcs etc). The desired applications of choice requiring many parallel tasks, so CPU cores and GPGPU/OpenCL, RAM and some fast storage is needed. Now I'm looking for state-of-the-art workstations and it will be an Xeon W based system with >= 10C, >= 64GB RAM, GPGPU/OpenCL enabled graphics (Nvidia Quadro P5000 or AMD Radeon Pro WX91000), PCIe NVMe Boot and separate SSD general purpose storage, 10gbps network and 27" graphics LED monitor. Price tag between 7k - 9k €. Funny, in sum the software will be under 1k €. Will be my system for the next five years.

History shows us that the old stars in proprietary workstations (SGI, SUN, HP, DEC/Compaq) started there doom/downfall in the mid 90th with the rise of Pentium CPU, Windows NT 4 GNU/Linux. Also they scrubbed there strenght and trust in there OS's fighting worthless standardization wars. In the end your mind should be lighted.

Your attitude make me think your customer is aged >70 years and don't think about time and/or money. Nice! Want to have such cash cow! ... Hey! I have already! :-)
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby foetz » Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:42 pm

hamei wrote:"Do you really want to change that extension ?" No ! Of course not ! I fucking highlighted the filename and added those letters because I am an ignorant bozo without a clue ! Thank you for keeping me from doing any work !

haha yeah, unfortunately that goes for a lot of software from many companies.

Irinikus wrote:Hamie, I'm starting to become slightly irritated by you and your comments regarding my posts! (This has been incremental, so I do apologise in advance to the other members on this forum for the outburst which is to follow:) as I don't really think that it's fitting to refer to me as a looser!

he didn't mean you but the companies producing such stuff.

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:18 pm

@escimo, Wrong, from 2009 to 2017 is very old, but believe me, many companies used SGI for CGI still in 2009, you are mistaken

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby Krokodil » Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:44 pm

Irinikus wrote:If you want to experience an old school unix machine and aren't really interested in graphics, then why not just get yourself one of the DEC Alpha machines then?


Alphas cost far more for what you get. Go on eBay and price out a Tezro vs a 21364 powered Alphaserver. You will pay many times the Tezro for the Alphaserver, with no guarantees it'll work.


The Alphaservers and Alphastations are quite expensive on all 3rd party seller sites and Ebay. You will pay a minimum $1000 starting for a complete system and they unfortunately have limited use due to the hard to find software. I do have my own Alphaserver that is fitted out as an Alphastation, it is a nice machine. But you get more enjoyment out of an SGI system.

SGI's IRIX just happens to be one of the best desktop OSes ever designed. It's not perfect, but even with something like that 5dwm you can't replicate the feel on a modern OS. It just isn't currently possible.


And SGI systems happen to be among the best hobbyist systems as a result.
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:02 pm

So the summary of this topic would be: SGI still can and should be used in CGI professional since Octane 2 onwards and has no way to deny? It's not an old one, it's an option.

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby Krokodil » Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:12 pm

RobhG wrote:So the summary of this topic would be: SGI still can and should be used in CGI professional since Octane 2 onwards and has no way to deny? It's not an old one, it's an option.


Probably not a great idea. With SGI IRIX now being dead for over 11 years and the support of SGI hardware being dropped almost a decade ago. 10 years is eternity in the tech world.

You can try it if you want, but it will probably aggravate the hell out of you in the process.
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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:35 pm

Krokodil, No, especially now that I saw that spider home was made in Octane 2, Hotwheels AcceleRacers also and it was still used 2009, for sure I will not regret, as the same users said worth trying after all it was used mostly of CGI why try to make up a seri and own on YouTube with it!

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby RobhG » Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:19 pm

Raion-fox, How do you transfer SGI files to "modern" CPU and the opposite?

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby Raion-Fox » Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:39 pm

The simplest way is to setup an NFS 3 served on Linux, Solaris or BSD. A Windows compatible solution is either FTP or SMB (gods help you if you choose the latter)

Since USB mass storage is not a thing on IRIX this is the easiest manner.
:O3x02L: R16000 700MHz 8GB RAM kanna
:Octane: R12000 300MHz SI 896MB RAM yuuka
:Octane2: R12000A 400MHz V6 2.5GB RAM
:Tezro: Quad R16000 700MHz V12 8GB RAM murasaki
:Indy: (Acclaim) R4600 133MHz XL Graphics 32MB RAM
:Indy: (Challenge S) R4600 133MHz (MIPS III Build Server)

I am probably posting from yangxiaolong, HP Z230 with Xeon E3-1230v3, 16GB RAM, GeForce 750ti, and running NetBSD and Windows 8.1 Embedded.
Owner and operator of http://irix.pw

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Re: SGI IRIX and computer graphics currently? What that should i use ?

Unread postby Irinikus » Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:03 pm

foetz wrote:
hamei wrote:"Do you really want to change that extension ?" No ! Of course not ! I fucking highlighted the filename and added those letters because I am an ignorant bozo without a clue ! Thank you for keeping me from doing any work !

haha yeah, unfortunately that goes for a lot of software from many companies.

Irinikus wrote:Hamie, I'm starting to become slightly irritated by you and your comments regarding my posts! (This has been incremental, so I do apologise in advance to the other members on this forum for the outburst which is to follow:) as I don't really think that it's fitting to refer to me as a looser!

he didn't mean you but the companies producing such stuff.


If that’s the case, then I humbly apologize to you Hamei and everyone else for my unnecessary outburst. (It was just our past history of arguing that unfortunately led to me taking this the wrong way.)
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