Rendering in Hardware

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scottE
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby scottE » Mon Jan 06, 2014 10:34 pm

you'd just have to provide all external images (textures, backgrounds ...)


I don't think that should be a problem. (Same with .ma files.)

I don't imagine issues between systems and things not being the same in the final renders, though. My understanding that's generally only an issue between processor kinds (Intel vs. MIPS for e.g.). Is this actually the case? What might cause the difference between CPUs in the same processor family?

Depending on how things plan out, it may be convenient to divide rendering shot by shot. Effects shots like the water (splashing &c.) might be the most taxing to do. But maybe these files could be prebaked beforehand before delivery.

Well. Started this project by wondering how I was going to do this. Looked around, and determined I didn't have much personally. I figured hardware rendering could be used here. But if there are folk who are willing to lend their unused CPU cycles for an art project, I think this is a lot more feasible.
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby robespierre » Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:16 am

Rendering multiple passes for later compositing can take some special setup, I don't have much experience with Maya so I don't know if it helps you with this. Houdini and Cinema4D have features that make it very simple. That is assuming you are going to have people run the jobs manually and not use a distributed rendering app.

Rendering software is like any program, it's output is a function of the inputs and the code. One thing that may be significant is that most renderers use some form of randomness to cover up bias in their calculations, and different types of computers may be better or worse at supplying randomness (sometimes a hardware random source is built in, sometimes it isn't). More generally, the predictability (and therefore correctness) of a calculation can depend on the ordering of memory accesses. Processors with multiple CPUs or cores are affected more by this because there are more things happening at the same time. Memory ordering can be different between processor families and between members of the same family, and is also affected by compiler optimizations. So this is probably the reason for different output on Intel vs. MIPS, if that does happen. There are bugs too, of course.
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby smj » Wed Jan 08, 2014 2:42 am

Well I could be talked into dedicating some Origin 300 or Altix 350 time. Seems like it would be fun to get either setup to do some of your scene rendering, though I'm guessing easier to handle in batch mode vs. distributed rendering kicked off across the Internet. (I also have about 24 Harpertown cores handyish if x86 was wanted.)
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby vishnu » Fri Jan 10, 2014 11:04 pm

smj wrote:Well I could be talked into dedicating some Origin 300 or Altix 350 time. Seems like it would be fun to get either setup to do some of your scene rendering, though I'm guessing easier to handle in batch mode vs. distributed rendering kicked off across the Internet. (I also have about 24 Harpertown cores handyish if x86 was wanted.)

You have rendering software installed on all those beasts? :shock:
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby smj » Sat Jan 11, 2014 3:43 am

vishnu wrote:You have rendering software installed on all those beasts? :shock:

Well no, and certainly nothing commercial. I mean I might have c-ray or something on the Origin, that's it.

It must be painfully obvious that I'm not a Maya user, or a modeling or f/x type. I thought some of the comments around file types might indicate that the proper input files for renderers other than Mental Ray could be produced. And that there'd be open source options that could be installed as needed. Probably a spectacularly bad set of assumptions... :oops:
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby vishnu » Sun Jan 12, 2014 11:27 pm

There are open source projects that hope to some day be able to render for maya, but they're all either still on the ground floor or have already been abandoned. The problem is, how do you get developers to pitch in to making a product that can compete with something like Mental Ray? Blender pulled it off because when they went open source they already had a pretty complete product, but starting from scratch to hopefully compete with the current state of the art in rendering is a pretty daunting task... :|
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby hamei » Mon Jan 13, 2014 1:33 am

vishnu wrote:There are open source projects that hope to some day be able to render for maya, but they're all either still on the ground floor or have already been abandoned.

Disclaimer : I don't know doodly about this. But what's Pixie ? A while back someone here got it running on Irix, I think. If it's at all modern, should be buildable on the Altix ?

Disclaimer II : I need more fish oil or something. Or a new brain. The latest Pixie 2.26 is in nekoware. Competent compton tested it as faster than BMRT by a factor of ten and the Ayam guy built a plugin for it. Supposed to be multi-threaded. Let's see how much grunt them Itanics really have ! Go for it, sm :D
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby vishnu » Mon Jan 13, 2014 10:40 am

hamei wrote:
vishnu wrote:There are open source projects that hope to some day be able to render for maya, but they're all either still on the ground floor or have already been abandoned.

Disclaimer : I don't know doodly about this. But what's Pixie ? A while back someone here got it running on Irix, I think. If it's at all modern, should be buildable on the Altix ?

Disclaimer II : I need more fish oil or something. Or a new brain. The latest Pixie 2.26 is in nekoware. Competent compton tested it as faster than BMRT by a factor of ten and the Ayam guy built a plugin for it. Supposed to be multi-threaded. Let's see how much grunt them Itanics really have ! Go for it, sm :D

Yes but unfortunately IRIX versions of Maya don't export to the renderman file format... :roll:
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby scottE » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:56 am

vishnu wrote:
hamei wrote:
vishnu wrote:There are open source projects that hope to some day be able to render for maya, but they're all either still on the ground floor or have already been abandoned.

Disclaimer : I don't know doodly about this. But what's Pixie ? A while back someone here got it running on Irix, I think. If it's at all modern, should be buildable on the Altix ?

Disclaimer II : I need more fish oil or something. Or a new brain. The latest Pixie 2.26 is in nekoware. Competent compton tested it as faster than BMRT by a factor of ten and the Ayam guy built a plugin for it. Supposed to be multi-threaded. Let's see how much grunt them Itanics really have ! Go for it, sm :D

Yes but unfortunately IRIX versions of Maya don't export to the renderman file format... :roll:


Without MTOR, I don't think any version does, but I haven't really messed with PRman since the late 1990s. It may be necessary to put me back onto rendering in hardware for this reason. Unless I start from scratch, knuckle down and learn to use blender; I've little faith in file conversions (like Maya to Blender, assuming that's even feasible), unless others have had really good experiences with such things.

But thanks to a forum member, I'm now set to start looking for a V12 (hopefully with a DCD), so I won't need to limp along with the V8 and it's issues forever. (When I get a spare moment I'll need to update the hinv for Sarcosuchus_imperator.)

Looking over this discussion makes me realize just how rusty I am. I've been away from 3D for a long time, it feels.
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby vishnu » Mon Jan 13, 2014 1:12 pm

scottE wrote:Unless I start from scratch, knuckle down and learn to use blender...

I strongly recommend against doing this, Maya, even at version 6.5, is immensely more capable than Blender and in the same vein if you're ever going to work in the industry having Maya expertise on your resume will get you vastly more points than Blender. I have the utmost respect for the Blender guys and what they're doing but honestly, unless Blender experiences multiple quantum leaps there's no point even comparing the two...
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby robespierre » Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:41 pm

There is a Renderman plugin for the Irix version of Maya. I forget what it was called.
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby vishnu » Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:57 am

I think Pixar dropped the IRIX port of Renderman about 10 years ago, but even if they would still sell an IRIX version I'm pretty sure smj doesn't want to shell out the megabucks it would take to build a Renderman renderfarm out of his spare O300s... :|
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby robespierre » Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:51 pm

right but there are other programs that can render ribs.
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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby foetz » Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:18 pm

robespierre wrote:There is a Renderman plugin for the Irix version of Maya. I forget what it was called.

mtor. the full package with guis and stuff was called rat (renderman artist tools)

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Re: Rendering in Hardware

Unread postby scottE » Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:54 pm

vishnu wrote:I think Pixar dropped the IRIX port of Renderman about 10 years ago, but even if they would still sell an IRIX version I'm pretty sure smj doesn't want to shell out the megabucks it would take to build a Renderman renderfarm out of his spare O300s... :|


Yep, and it's out of my reach as well.

Using Maya's default renderer is certainly feasible. It's not the best, but with the right attention it can produce decent-enough images.

Pity there's no way to export files to PoVRay. That was always one of my favorite renderers.
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