Cryptocurrency?

For friendly off topic discussion not covered in a forum above.
Forum rules
No politics, please.
User avatar
Irinikus
Posts: 590
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:25 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby Irinikus » Tue Dec 26, 2017 10:38 am

What are your thoughts regarding the cryptocurrency's possible link to AI?

The use of a blockchain type system to serve as a secure means of communication and transactions between the various AI's? (The Sophia AI being one of them)

Considering the nature of the blockchain, how would we be able to maintain control over such a system, especially if it becomes divergent?

Our usefulness and human beings, depends largely on our level experience, but if all AI's share an AI cloud (blockchain based), how long will it be before the sum of their experiences surpasses that of any human being alive? And what will that mean for us (the common man)?
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ... Image
Image ........................ Image
Image ........................ Image Image

User avatar
vishnu
Donor
Donor
Posts: 3361
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 3:25 pm
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota USA

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby vishnu » Tue Dec 26, 2017 11:03 pm

I don't think there's anything to worry about. Yes, it's possible to build an expert system that is capable of beating a human at a board game, but an AI that not only exceeds, but is capable of overwhelming the entirety of the of the human presence on this planet? No conceivable way, not now, not later, not ever. :D
Project:
Temporarily lost at sea...
Plan:
World domination! Or something...

:Tezro: :Octane2:

robespierre
Posts: 1672
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:28 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby robespierre » Wed Dec 27, 2017 2:41 am

Who knows, maybe Skynet is the hero of the story :)
:PI: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indigo2IMP:

User avatar
commodorejohn
Posts: 684
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 1:22 pm
Contact:

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby commodorejohn » Wed Dec 27, 2017 6:59 am

Irinikus wrote:Considering the nature of the blockchain, how would we be able to maintain control over such a system, especially if it becomes divergent?

Unplug it?
Computers: Amiga 1200, DEC VAXStation 4000/60, DEC MicroPDP-11/73
Synthesizers: Roland JX-10/SH-09/MT-32/D-50, Yamaha DX7-II/V50/TX7/TG33/FB-01, Korg MS-20 Mini/ARP Odyssey/DW-8000/X5DR, Ensoniq SQ-80, E-mu Proteus/2, Moog Satellite, Oberheim SEM

User avatar
Irinikus
Posts: 590
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:25 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby Irinikus » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:20 am

commodorejohn wrote:
Irinikus wrote:Considering the nature of the blockchain, how would we be able to maintain control over such a system, especially if it becomes divergent?

Unplug it?


That's exactly the problem! If it's based on blockchain technology, you can't just simply unplug it, as it's completely decentralised! (you can't edit or delete it either)

You would need to bring down the entire web (if that's even possible) and what about hard-drive backups!

The terrifying thing is that they actually are planning on doing this! (AI Singularity)

The videos that I've watched of the Sophia AI Robot terrify me. It really makes me question what our consciousness really is?

A system like that could easily render the majority of humanity obsolete in the future. (We get tired and we tend to forget things and we as individuals don't have instantaneous access the world's entire knowledge base, machines don't suffer from these pitfalls.)
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ... Image
Image ........................ Image
Image ........................ Image Image

robespierre
Posts: 1672
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:28 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby robespierre » Thu Dec 28, 2017 1:34 pm

"Blockchain technology" is a buzzword for the scheme developed by Satoshi for distributed consensus that resists Sybil attacks. Its cornerstones are difficulty and reward: nodes compete with one another for a share of the hashrate, and at equilibrium, the reward for mining a block (coinbase + fees) equals the cost all nodes spent on mining during 10 minutes. Censorship resistance is not a goal: if the holders of most of the hash power don't want to include your data, you're S.O.L. Likewise, the scheme does not provide secrecy: blocks are validated by the presence of each input as an unspent output of the existing chain. This means that the ownership of capital can be traced through time (every BTC ultimately was created by a coinbase transaction and the node that created it had to publish that block to the network, which could have been logged by network monitoring).

I fail to see how a rampant AI could utilize "blockchain technology", for two reasons: first, because money is a representation of human labor. The AI needs to trick people into working for it, or else steal it from accounts in some way. Second, because it solves the wrong problem. If your goal is to communicate with other conspirators sub rosa, you don't use a public immutable data structure that can deanonymize you.

Botnets already exist and their C&C mechanisms are not based on blockchains.
:PI: :O2: :Indigo2IMP: :Indigo2IMP:

User avatar
Irinikus
Posts: 590
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2016 4:25 am
Location: Cape Town, South Africa

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby Irinikus » Thu Dec 28, 2017 7:22 pm

I understand exactly what you’re saying concerning the current use of “Blockchain technology” in it's current form.

Such an idea doesn't just have to be used as a means of keeping track of “bit coins “, it could, be expanded upon (greatly increased in complexity) and be used to keep track of any type of transaction. Communication of information between people concerning shared experiences, for instance, is a form of a transaction based system.

What I’m talking about, is the concept of using a technology based on this to validate and securely store “memories” (shared experiences between various AI's or various aspects of the same AI) in a decentralised, non corruptible sense. (The concept would have to be evolved way beyond it’s present form in this case.)

As far as I understand it, blockchain is not bitcoin itself, it’s simply the medium being used to keep track of it. Bit Coin is a "conceptual currency" that is kept track of using blockchain technology.

Correct if I’m wrong in my thinking and I won’t belabor this point any further.
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ................................... Image Image Image Image Image Image Image Image
Image ... Image
Image ........................ Image
Image ........................ Image Image

User avatar
VenomousPinecone
Posts: 2180
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2005 2:10 pm
Location: Groom Lake, NV

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby VenomousPinecone » Wed Jan 03, 2018 3:47 pm

commodorejohn wrote:Eventually that's going to stop looking like a winning proposition to potential newcomers, and then the real fun starts.

Amway and Herbalife don't make everyone millionaires? Shit. :lol:

commodorejohn wrote:* (well, if you don't count prostitution rings and international heroin smuggling, anyway.)

Don't count them out. Those industries are massive and fare well in just about every economy, up or down. The ability for them to move assets around without using the banking system is a massive boon to them, although personally I doubt they "hold" any of the bitcoin. They aren't investors in that sense.

Jack Luminous
Donor
Donor
Posts: 209
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:59 am
Location: PARIS

Re: Cryptocurrency?

Unread postby Jack Luminous » Thu Jan 04, 2018 6:01 am

vishnu wrote:I don't think there's anything to worry about. Yes, it's possible to build an expert system that is capable of beating a human at a board game, but an AI that not only exceeds, but is capable of overwhelming the entirety of the of the human presence on this planet? No conceivable way, not now, not later, not ever. :D


Thanks ! I worked 5 years in AI after PHD and I can't help laughing when I read things about the topic. AI is not magic and certainly not what is described in Sci-Fi books or newspaper articles. Basically, an input (among a set of possible inputs) gives an output going thru a blackbox (whether a neural net, hidden Markov models, set of fixed rules, fuzzy logic, fixed heuristics, expert systems, whatever...). It's only a framework of mathematical methods to classify data, not much else. Nothing to do with human intelligence. AI can at best mimic basic clues of human intelligence. It works quite well for Go, chess game and shape recognition. :D
:Octane2: :Octane: :Octane: :O2:


Return to “Everything Else”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: commodorejohn and 4 guests